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Writer's Discuss - Lore, A Tool Or Chains? (#36)

• Sotek

  

  Member
   

  April 3, 2016

  Writers Discuss

  Topic # 36 - Lore, a Tool or Chains

  ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

  You have worked on your plot and ironed out the creases. The characters have lives which you've fleshed out and the story is on the brink of becoming a classic. Everything is going well then someone point's to a seemingly trivial event and says...

  "That wouldn't happen. They don't use the weapon you gave them. What are Thalmor doing there anyway?" And at that moment your world comes crumbling down.....

  Or does it?

  Are you one to use Lore as a guide and aid you in your hunt for perfection? Or do you see lore as a hindrance to your imagination?

  Here are some questions to consider:

  Do you as a writer consider Lore to be a useful tool or is it a chain, binding your imagination?

  How far should we as writers go when we consider Lore?

  What have you done in the past to rectify lore breaking situations? 

  ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

  If you have any suggestions for future topics include them in the comments section!

  Writers Discuss

  Topic # 36 - Lore, a Tool or Chains

  ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

  You have worked on your plot and ironed out the creases. The characters have lives which you've fleshed out and the story is on the brink of becoming a classic. Everything is going well then someone point's to a seemingly trivial event and says...

  "That wouldn't happen. They don't use the weapon you gave them. What are Thalmor doing there anyway?" And at that moment your world comes crumbling down.....

  Or does it?

  Are you one to use Lore as a guide and aid you in your hunt for perfection? Or do you see lore as a hindrance to your imagination?

  Here are some questions to consider:

  Do you as a writer consider Lore to be a useful tool or is it a chain, binding your imagination?

  How far should we as writers go when we consider Lore?

  What have you done in the past to rectify lore breaking situations? 

  ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

  If you have any suggestions for future topics include them in the comments section!

• ProbsCoolerThanYou

  

  Member
   

  April 3, 2016

  I'd say lore isn't quite a chain, but it definitely can be limiting at some times. I remember writing a story once that had the potential to be quite long. It was partly based off of a character of mine, but I also added my own elements, like how she is visited by Akatosh occasionally in her sleep. It was only once I got to page 36 that I realized the Aedra/Divines don't really do anything with any humans, and I really didn't want my character to be a special snowflake. RIP The Gift of Akatosh 2k14. 

  Honestly, I just don't write many things that involve lore. Almost all of my TES stuff is poetry, where I don't have to acknowledge overarching themes. I never was one for grand, godly plots full of intrigue and pious revenge anyways though. 

  In the end, I think that a story shouldn't strive to break the lore, but shouldn't try so hard to avoid breaking lore that it becomes a retelling of various lore articles with a character in-between. 

  I'd say lore isn't quite a chain, but it definitely can be limiting at some times. I remember writing a story once that had the potential to be quite long. It was partly based off of a character of mine, but I also added my own elements, like how she is visited by Akatosh occasionally in her sleep. It was only once I got to page 36 that I realized the Aedra/Divines don't really do anything with any humans, and I really didn't want my character to be a special snowflake. RIP The Gift of Akatosh 2k14. 

  Honestly, I just don't write many things that involve lore. Almost all of my TES stuff is poetry, where I don't have to acknowledge overarching themes. I never was one for grand, godly plots full of intrigue and pious revenge anyways though. 

  In the end, I think that a story shouldn't strive to break the lore, but shouldn't try so hard to avoid breaking lore that it becomes a retelling of various lore articles with a character in-between. 

• Chris

  

  Member
   

  April 3, 2016

  Well, the Aedra have interacted with humans, but it was mainly during the days when the Nine still walked the Earth, like the 4th Era. Though Talos, or an avatar, did speak with the Neravarine

  Well, the Aedra have interacted with humans, but it was mainly during the days when the Nine still walked the Earth, like the 4th Era. Though Talos, or an avatar, did speak with the Neravarine

• The Long-Chapper

  

  Member
   

  April 3, 2016

  I think it's totally still possible, by sending projections of themselves. I totally mess with this in Straag. Appearing in a dream is not a physical interaction, which I agree, wouldn't be done, but dreams, are dreams. 

  I think it's totally still possible, by sending projections of themselves. I totally mess with this in Straag. Appearing in a dream is not a physical interaction, which I agree, wouldn't be done, but dreams, are dreams. 

• ProbsCoolerThanYou

  

  Member
   

  April 3, 2016

  I suppose I worded that wrong. Yes I suppose they could have been sent an avatar or the sort in a dream, but she didn't see him in dreams. She literally saw Akatosh in the form of a dragon in a sort of sacred grove that she was transported to occasionally in her sleep. I think that falls outside of the realm of what most Aedra are willing to do.

  I suppose I worded that wrong. Yes I suppose they could have been sent an avatar or the sort in a dream, but she didn't see him in dreams. She literally saw Akatosh in the form of a dragon in a sort of sacred grove that she was transported to occasionally in her sleep. I think that falls outside of the realm of what most Aedra are willing to do.
• Sotek

  

  Member
   

  April 4, 2016

  I've a thought which I'm going to throw to the wolves and see who bites.

  Florentius actually speaks to Arkay does he not? Ok he could be mad as a hatter yet he knows when someone has been kidnapped and sends you to rescue them. Arkay told him about it. Upon their said rescue they admit that they didn't think anyone knew of their abduction.

  He is certainly not dreaming when this goes on.

  Daedra Lords will appear to mortals like Hircine so just how far would it be pushing the limits to have Aedra speak to a mortal and in the hour of need appearing to them.

  Another question, who is it that speaks to you in Morrowind at the start of the game when you are ‘sleeping’?

  I've a thought which I'm going to throw to the wolves and see who bites.

  Florentius actually speaks to Arkay does he not? Ok he could be mad as a hatter yet he knows when someone has been kidnapped and sends you to rescue them. Arkay told him about it. Upon their said rescue they admit that they didn't think anyone knew of their abduction.

  He is certainly not dreaming when this goes on.

  Daedra Lords will appear to mortals like Hircine so just how far would it be pushing the limits to have Aedra speak to a mortal and in the hour of need appearing to them.

  Another question, who is it that speaks to you in Morrowind at the start of the game when you are ‘sleeping’?

• Karver the Lorc

  

  Member
   

  April 4, 2016

  Azura speaks to you.

  Plus in Morrowind you (supposedly) meet Talos, before the ending. He looks like imperial soldier and gives you his lucky coin. Wulf was his name I think.

  Azura speaks to you.

  Plus in Morrowind you (supposedly) meet Talos, before the ending. He looks like imperial soldier and gives you his lucky coin. Wulf was his name I think.

• Chris

  

  Member
   

  April 4, 2016

  Yeah, it was. I have a lore article from a year or two ago about that

  Yeah, it was. I have a lore article from a year or two ago about that

• Karver the Lorc

  

  Member
   

  April 4, 2016

  I love Lore, and I can´t imagine writing without using it. It actually prompts to dig deeper when I write, to research more things, because I want to be as lore-accurate as possible. It´s a living world out there, with everything you need, you just have to find it. Long time ago I was writing stories of my own world, everything was made as I went, but writing stories for already existing world...it is awesome.

  How far should you go? That´s absolutely up to individual writers. I´m sorry I might sound little bit resolute here, but for me, there are only two types of stories. Lore-accurate and those that aren´t lore immersive. If I see someone has put disclaimer that he doesn´t follow lore, I say OK and read it and have fun with it, looking at things from different perspective. Now comes the resolute thing. There is nothing in between for me. You either follow Lore or you don´t.

  To rectify lore breaking situations...well, I went back and fixed it, you silly 

  I love Lore, and I can´t imagine writing without using it. It actually prompts to dig deeper when I write, to research more things, because I want to be as lore-accurate as possible. It´s a living world out there, with everything you need, you just have to find it. Long time ago I was writing stories of my own world, everything was made as I went, but writing stories for already existing world...it is awesome.

  How far should you go? That´s absolutely up to individual writers. I´m sorry I might sound little bit resolute here, but for me, there are only two types of stories. Lore-accurate and those that aren´t lore immersive. If I see someone has put disclaimer that he doesn´t follow lore, I say OK and read it and have fun with it, looking at things from different perspective. Now comes the resolute thing. There is nothing in between for me. You either follow Lore or you don´t.

  To rectify lore breaking situations...well, I went back and fixed it, you silly 

• SpottedFawn

  

  Member
   

  April 4, 2016

  I for one consider lore to be an extremely useful tool in crafting a story. Now there isn't as much lore on the Skaal to work with, but I actually enjoy the fact that there are some open spaces for me to sort of 'fill in' the gaps. I can see how keeping a story very closely tied to lore could be a barrier to the imagination; a little like trying to swim through a lake with way too many fish, there isn't enough room to maneuver or do the things you want to due to lore restrictions.

  I suppose one of the reasons I chose to write about the Skaal in particular, while I adore the Bosmer race and culture, I did not feel confident in my lore-knowledge to write stories set in Valenwood like I wanted to. I prefer to either do it right or not at all. The Skaal were a much smaller mountain to climb, and it only took an afternoon or two to learn all there was to know about them. So I found my 'opening' into the TES world, then took it and ran.

  I personally don't mind if an author goes for lore accuracy or not, but when it comes to myself, I try to go for authencity. I do have a disclaimer on my Legends of the Skaal TOC that the story won't always be lore-friendly or accurate, so I suppose that let's me skip your third question!

  I for one consider lore to be an extremely useful tool in crafting a story. Now there isn't as much lore on the Skaal to work with, but I actually enjoy the fact that there are some open spaces for me to sort of 'fill in' the gaps. I can see how keeping a story very closely tied to lore could be a barrier to the imagination; a little like trying to swim through a lake with way too many fish, there isn't enough room to maneuver or do the things you want to due to lore restrictions.

  I suppose one of the reasons I chose to write about the Skaal in particular, while I adore the Bosmer race and culture, I did not feel confident in my lore-knowledge to write stories set in Valenwood like I wanted to. I prefer to either do it right or not at all. The Skaal were a much smaller mountain to climb, and it only took an afternoon or two to learn all there was to know about them. So I found my 'opening' into the TES world, then took it and ran.

  I personally don't mind if an author goes for lore accuracy or not, but when it comes to myself, I try to go for authencity. I do have a disclaimer on my Legends of the Skaal TOC that the story won't always be lore-friendly or accurate, so I suppose that let's me skip your third question!