Forums » Elder Scrolls

• Jesse

  

  • 62 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 10:47 AM EDT

  Henson, I may be misunderstanding what you're saying. If so, excuse me. For one thing, Christian morals aren't produced by secular means, even if those of other religions might. Christian morality is much stricter than that of any society. When Christ lived, his teaching was revolutionary. He took the Law of Moses much farther than even the most devout Jews ever had. Even now, Christianity is stricter than most religions in terms of personal holiness and treatment of others.
  
  *When I speak of Christianity, I mean following the Bible strictly.
• Henson

  

  • 490 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 10:51 AM EDT

  Oh I just meant that religious morals can be reproduced by secular means, that's all.
  
  I don't want to pick on just one religion, but it is so the Christian bible has some very immoral writings in it. And unfortunately most people just pick and choose. Picking and choosing is when people choose their own morality which I am for, I just wish more people would align themselves with the betterment of society.
• Jesse

  

  • 62 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 11:03 AM EDT

  Such as? I'm interested to hear what in the Bible you call immoral. I totally agree that people pick and choose. That's the problem with discussions of religion. Different people follow their creeds with different levels of strictness. I, and those I respect as true Christians, follow all of God's commands as best we can. All I can do when talking to others is look to the Bible and ask them to do the same.
• Henson

  

  • 490 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 11:12 AM EDT

  To save time, the biggest one I bring up is slavery, owning people as property.
• Jesse

  

  • 62 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 11:26 AM EDT

  And where does the Bible advocate slavery? In the Old Testament, Jews are told to free their slaves on Jubilee years. In the New Testament, masters are told not to mistreat their slaves, and those who are slaves are told to respect their masters and work as if they worked for the Lord. Is that advocating slavery? No, it is recognizing a societal norm, and calling on Christians to reflect Christ even as they live in that society.

  Besides, the slavery of Roman times and Old Testament times was not like what we think of as slavery (i.e. black slaves in the time of the Civil War). The Hebrew term for slavery includes the ideas of hired servant or bondservant, and from other places in the New Testament that seems to be what the Bible addresses. In case you still have doubts about whether the NT advocates slavery, let me quote Ephesians 6:5-9:

  "Bondservants, obey your earthly masters with fear and trembling, with a sincere heart, as you would Christ, not by the way of eye-service, as people-pleasers, but as bondservants of Christ, doing the will of God from the heart, rendering service with a good will as to the Lord and not to man, knowing that whatever good anyone does, this he will receive back from the Lord, whether he is a bondservant or is free. Masters, do the same to them, and stop your threatening, knowing that he who is both their Master and yours is in heaven, and that there is no partiality with him."

  This is the main passage in the NT that even addresses slavery, and clearly it is different from the slavery in the times of the Civil War. That is how Christ calls masters and servants to live. Would you still say that is immoral? 

  Just to play devil's advocate here, based on the discussion, what makes slavery itself immoral? I'm not saying that it isn't, I'm just wondering how you can make that judgement when your standard of morality is so abstract.

  Sorry about the whole "saving time" thing. :/

• Jesse

  

  • 62 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 11:30 AM EDT

  What is wrong with worsening the society? If it is wrong, how is that established? If it isn't wrong, what right does the society have to punish actions that do that?

• Vazgen

  

  • 1483 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 11:30 AM EDT

  Sorry to cut out your conversation, but all these comments are not on topic, am I correct? Maybe not flood Drakon's discussion with this and move to General Chat or continue via PM?

• Jesse

  

  • 62 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 11:34 AM EDT

  True. Sorry to the OP for going off on this tangent. Henson and Overhate, I'm glad to continue this discussion somewhere else, as long as we can keep it civil. If you want to exchange PMs, that's fine, or we could start another topic in the misc. forum. 

• Henson

  

  • 490 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 11:38 AM EDT

  Told to free their fellow Jewish slaves in seven years, but remain for life if the owner gives them a wife and they have children. The whole awl through the ear.
  
  Non jew slaves? Keep them for life. Very direct instructions.
  
  I will PM you....
• NeroKitty

  

  • 661 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 12:24 PM EDT

  You want Immoral from the Bible? Try the dashing of children's brains against rocks.

• RuneRed

  

  • 856 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 1:00 PM EDT

  Most of the comments are off topic (some of mine included). What happened to the hosts? The topic is "What is the most evil or worst thing you've done in a video game?" It is not a debate defining 'evil'. (I'm not saying that there is anything wrong with that type of discussion, only that it doesn't belong here - we should start a new discussion if we wish to pursue it further and not 'hi-jack' this post.)

• Drakon

  

  • 159 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 3:16 PM EDT

  thank you! yes the whole point was "What is the most evil or worst thing you've done in a video game?" not defining evil! come on people!

• NeroKitty

  

  • 661 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 3:29 PM EDT

  Well you should have made that clear Drakon.

• NeroKitty

  

  • 661 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 3:45 PM EDT

  The most evil thing I have ever done in a video game was kill. Its that simple.

• Jesse

  

  • 62 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 3:46 PM EDT

  From Psalm 137:9: "Blessed shall he be who takes your little ones and dashes them against the rock!"  In context, the psalmist is talking about the people of Judah while in captivity in Babylon. He looks forward to the day when the sinful Babylonians would be punished for the things they did to the Israelites. Verse 9 follows verse 8, where the psalmist says that the Babylonians would be repayed with the things they had done to their captives. Harsh? Yes. But he is simply asking that the Babylonians be punished by the same things they had done to the people of Israel. He didn't pull the idea for the punishment out of thin air.
  

  Again, sorry to the original poster for derailing the topic. This will be my last post here, so if anyone wants to follow up on the tangent or any other Biblical topics please PM me (I'm looking at you, Henson).

• NeroKitty

  

  • 661 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 3:47 PM EDT

  Dude I know :P  I used to be a christian myself. I was just instigating.

• NeroKitty

  

  • 661 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 4:01 PM EDT

  Although I do like your response.

• NeroKitty

  

  • 661 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 4:46 PM EDT

  By not defining it and just stating the evil you've committed.

• Boom2215

  

  • 25 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 4:56 PM EDT

  But what if you consider killing evil and I do not? Is it evil then?

• Quincy Des Lamarde

  

  • 8 posts
   

  October 15, 2013 9:40 PM EDT

  Oh dear sweet merciful lord, when somebody asks about the worst things you've done, does it HAVE to turn into a "what is/are morality" debate? Really!? I'm glad the title post got edited for YOUR perception... Golly...

  Anyway, I'd have to say it was probably playing Oblivion on my friend's PC and putting all the Goblin Totem Staffs in the Imperial City after making everybody non-essential. I then stole the staffs back after the carnage and put them in a modded Gate. I then proceeded to use said mod to open Gates in all the towns. There were no survivors except me 

  Either that, or when in Skyrim I used the Fortify Resto glitch with a Amulet of Talos and a super-Illusion-buffed character to Shout Borri into towns then Frenzy him into slaughtering townsfolk... But I got bored before TOO many people died from that!

  Outside TES, I did destroy a town for the Spider Queen when I played Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning...

• Chris Diokno

  

  • 6 posts
   

  October 16, 2013 10:49 PM EDT

  For me, not saving the Council in ME1. Yeah, they did insult humanity, but they were otherwise good people and had a stable government. Or killing Wrex, I liked him.
• Seyd

  

  • 229 posts
   

  October 17, 2013 10:34 AM EDT

  Let's see, well, I've blown up Megaton, Enslaved New Vegas, Murdered countless innocents, like in Far Cry 3 when I get bored and execute civilians and jungle patrols. There was also that priest I ate, that guy I tortured with a mace, and all of those people I mutilated with the ripper. I've also murdered everyone in most of the towns in Skyrim. There's also all of those traders in Fallout New Vegas that I stalked and then murdered with a kitchen knife in the desert... Oh, and I killed all the strippers in Vegas, although I don't count that as bad. I also tortured a BUNCH of random people in Sheogorath's realm.

• Andy

  

  • 17 posts
   

  October 17, 2013 10:37 AM EDT

  I know that feel bro

• The Bard

  

  • 74 posts
   

  November 16, 2013 10:54 PM EST

  The guy shouldn't have been in the way.
• The Bard

  

  • 74 posts
   

  November 16, 2013 10:56 PM EST

  Lawful good is boring. Predictable at best. My lawful evil almost got our morally, uh... diverse D&D party killed.