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Lore Discussion: Gauldur's Race

    • 39 posts
    June 30, 2017 8:41 PM EDT

    So, I've been doing research into Gauldur and his three sons Jyrik, Sigdis, and Mikrul. Whilest doing so, I stumbled across something interesting. Gauldur is a Breton, not a Nord. I believe we found out this by going into the code, where he is listed as a Breton.

    This is especially interesting seeing as his sons are all Nords. This is shown by two points of fact. The first are their names which are Nordic. The second is that they are listed as Draugr, which if you look at the technical definition is the following.

    Draugr are undead Nordic warriors of Skyrim.

    -ElderScrolls Wikia

    So, Gauldur is a Breton in First Era Skyrim. His sons however are Nords. This is possible if Gauldur was married or at least involved with a female Nord. This may indeed be the case, but there is also the chance that he was just mislabeled in the programming. Consider also the fact that Gauldur's amulet is an Ancient Nord Amulet in style (others would include Kyne's Token and the Saarthal Amulet), as well as he is one of the earliest named arch-mages in Skyrim's history.

    So, what do you guys think? Anything in Lore that I missed that shows definitively either way? Do you think that he married a Nord or do you think he was mislabeled?

    • 1464 posts
    June 30, 2017 10:32 PM EDT

    Don't be afraid of the Lore Group, Ruined Crown :) This would be perfect there me thinks.

    Justiciar Thorien made a similar topic that might interest you: The Eye of Magnus Lost and Found. Similar but different like. You know what I mean.

    As for Gauldur, it looks like a Red Eagle sort of deal. Like Gauldur, Faolan should be a Breton rather than a Nord but he has all the trappings and draugrfication that a Nord would get. There's lots about the Merethic and First Eras that perplex us, and I'm no expert on this topic because wizards. I see no reason that i can think of right now that would prevent a Nord/Breton dalliance as you suggest.

    Gauldur's day was during King Harald's reign of 1E 143, the Battle of Glenumbra Moors that led to the liberation of the Bretons and the rise of High Rock as we know it today was in 1E 482.

    My memory is shocking, but I think I recall something about how a band of Nords (could be one of the Songs of the Return) stumbled onto a group of people we would call Bretons, and one of them spoke in the same tongue revealing themselves as men.

    These early days when then the seperation between Nede and Nord wasn't, perhaps, as pronounced as now may account for some of the answer. After all, early 1st Era was some 4k years ago. Interesting, will give this more thought.

    Edit to clarify briefly for those less familiar: Nords vs Nedes is a TES joke as Nords claim they were the first men and that's the official line most books portray. However, we reckon the indigenous people of Tamriel were Nedes, these folks migrated to Atmora, Yokuda and spread all over. That way, what the Nords say about being the first is true, but also not. For when they returned from Atmora - which itself is almost as mythical a homeland as Aldmeris - they were no longer Nedes but Nords instead. That migration occurred in the Mythic Era a time of, well, myth. Hard to say, but basically Nord and Nede would have been closer in dna as it were than now, although is 4k years enough time to account for racial change? Dunno.

    This post was edited by Paws at June 30, 2017 10:45 PM EDT
    • 1464 posts
    June 30, 2017 11:09 PM EDT

    Urgh, here's what I was on about: Here's the source: PGE 1 Ed

    Khosey, in his 'Tamrilean Tractates,' transcribes a firsthand account of the "discovery" of the Bretons by a Nordic hunting party. The Bretons, in ten generations of Elven intermingling and slavery, had become scarcely recognizable as humans. Indeed, the hunting party attacked them thinking they were some new strain of Aldmeri, halting their slaughter only when one of the oldest began to wail for his life, a shrieking plea that was spoken in broken Nordic. When word of this reached Windhelm, the Nords reasoned that the "Manmeri" beyond the Reach were, in fact, descended from human slaves taken during the Elven destruction of Saarthal. King Vrage made the first priority of his Empire the liberation of his long-tormented kinsmen in High Rock. His initial onslaught took him as far as the Bjoulsae, but beyond that the First Empire never established a lasting presence; the crafty Elves were too strong in their magic, and many of the Bretons aided the Elves against their would-be liberators. Ironically enough, it took the tyranny of the Alessian Order to finally free High Rock from Elven dominion. Although the Alessians were crushed at the Battle of Glenumbria Moors, this costly victory so weakened Aldmeri power that the Elves could no longer challenge the emerging nobility of Greater Bretony, who seized power throughout most of High Rock within two decades of the Alessian defeat.

    That's 1E 200, 282 years before Glenumbra Moors. Bretons were'nt as we know them now, weren't called Claude, Jean and the like. That culture didn't exist then to the point it does now. Despite the river's name. Hmm.

    All that is after the Gauldur legend, so how an enslaved Nedic proto-Breton managed to become Archmage is a wonder that only adds the Nords = Nedes idea. The last ship from Atmora landed a scant 75 years before Harald's reign and Gauldur's shit went down. So it could be that the Nords met their ancestral people and absorbed them, the distinction being an unknown number of mythical years of elven Perquisite of Coition.

    • Moderator
    • 85 posts
    July 1, 2017 7:47 AM EDT

    This discussion belongs in the lore group my friend, would you be kind enough to move it over, thanks man 

    • 39 posts
    July 1, 2017 10:35 AM EDT

    Oops, yeah sure thing! I originally wrote it up in the Lore section then I second guessed myself and put it here. Thanks for the clarification.

    • 223 posts
    July 1, 2017 10:36 AM EDT

    Well, as far as I know, children mostly inherit their mothers features. So they probably looked like Nords while Gauldur was a Breton. So his sons weren't just Nords. They were actually mixed race. Part mer as well, seeing as Bretons are the offspring of man and mer.

    • 39 posts
    July 1, 2017 10:56 AM EDT

    I believe they inherit their mother's race not just their features. A high elf mother makes high-elven children, the Nord blood might make them taller or shorter or even more muscular but that doesn't change their race (or rather species).

    • 223 posts
    July 1, 2017 10:57 AM EDT

    Just an idea here.