Forums » Elder Scrolls
Master and Legendary Difficulty
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Hi, I have not played skyrim in a long while since we had a baby in the last year. Now before I left I enjoyed playing on Master difficulty, and now that I am back I tried to make a character on legendary difficulty. Now the first few levels were not bad as long as a had a follower, BUT I felt like I was cheating.
I say this because using followers/summons is bypassing the mechanic that makes the higher difficulties harder. Since you followers/summons do not suffer any changes you are simply using them to bypass the increased difficulty. I have watched several videos of playthroughs on legendary and they seem to be similar to watching your follower fight the npcs while you shoot/hit/use spells that are equivalent to a water pistol to help out your follower. It becomes less like playing skyrim and more like playing chess, about placing your follower or summons where you need them and possibly assisting by healing or some other help (maybe furying or calming).
I know there are builds out there that do well on Master (Mason's are the ones I tried). But are these normally played with a follower or not? I kind of wish the follower and summons would be reduced in damage too and suffer more damage on higher difficulties. I kind of like the idea of taking my follower along into a crypt full of zombies because if I had a choice I would always take backup when the odds are against me in real life (wouldn't you) but at master difficulty taking Lydia with you is like taking a super hero with you to fight other superheroes while you are powerless (Lydia reminds me of wonderwoman sometimes).
The videos of people playing on legendary and than finding a safe spot to jump on that the npcs can't get to feels too cheap for me.I welcome any thoughts on the matter.
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Jasper, like I said I welcome comments but I am puzzled by your disagreement. Did you read my post? Before you disagree with me and be dismissive of my experience can you comment on your use of followers. Like I said in the post I have played several builds successfully on master (especially Masons) but any builds that I have played with a follower or summon tend to be much more powerful. Of course I realize as you power up turning up the difficulty has an importance but that was not the point of the discussion. I look at playing on master as a challenge but I feel using a follower or summon is a cheat around the increased difficulty and how alot of these videos of playthroughs on higher difficulties abuse the follower/summon.
Especially at low levels when a hit from a 2-hander can take you out in 1 blow, whereas a follower can take 10 of those hits and be fine.
So I guess your disagreeing with me at higher levels when you are all pimped out and maybe its at those points that the difficulty should be turned up, but when you first start out and go toe to toe with a bandit with similar gear to you and your hits do so much less than his, it is at these times where your hits seem like water pistol hits.
My recent attempt at master in the quest for the dragonstone (damn its been so long I cant remember the crypt name) I tried to take out that frostbite spider with simple flames and it was not fun, i had to use all my mana pots and still the spider was barely hurt. After fast traveling back to town and getting sven with no gear I ran back in and sven beat the spider with his dagger. This is all to illustrate how waterdowned your character can feel and how much the game shifts with followers and summons.
I could have also found myself an enchanted sword and meleed the spider but I was trying to play a destruction mage. And on that playthough I had not found one yet (the first you find is usually from the draug at the end of the dungeon). And why should sven in his regular clothes wielding his dagger be more powerful than me?
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You wasted too much time writing that out! :) I did read your post. Its why I had an opinion towards it.
I play Master from the get go, and it's why I disagree. Bandits up to Highwaymen are easily defeated with or without enchantments. My simple solution is 'when hit, hit back a little harder' It sounds sily seeing as how you cant modify your damage beyond anything normal when you first start. Some things like Undead, animals, or Spriggans makes sense they could be doing damage like that, and it makes sense they are an extreme threat. I saw lions getting shot multiple times and still charge into a fight. Undead dont feel pain, and Spriggans are just scary, and I am surprised an Axe doesnt do more damage to them (buts a discussion for another time).
As for the follower thing, every person is like that. Not just followers. However I have seen Faendel go down when he fouught the spider. So I am bit skeptical. It could be Sven is just a badass? I doubt that however. -
I use followers (usually a Lydia) during the early levels of play. Bethesda didn't do a great job with the difficulty levels on Skyrim...
When playing on master difficulty you have to either choose to avoid certain encounters until much later levels or take a follower/summon with you to rub some of the damage away...
It depends on your build of course but a cave bear can absolutely crush you in seconds and it's not fun to keep dying...
I'm not one for adjusting my game difficulty to 'get me through' certain encounters so bringing along a follower gives me the option of flanking tougher opponents and I don't feel too cheap about it...it would have been certain death to face them head on.
I'm glad that summons/followers don't get gimped on higher levels. They may take alot of damage but they don't have the best AI and would get shredded if they had your characters weaknesses.
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I have a character that I only played on legendary and yes... It was much akin to playing chess. If you summon you can get by without a follower. I believe certain "classes" are more viable to start at level one (a summoner) while others should only play on legendary at later levels.
I've started an assassin and ranger, solo, on level one at legendary and was thoroughly perturbed at my character's incompetence. -
Hey John,
First off, congrats on the kid. That is always awesome news.
Personally, Master is the "right" feel for when I play and it is different for everyone. Legendary is just a somewhat silly numbers change into the ridiculous making fights longer, and in turn, more "difficult" as you will be taking severe amounts of damage.
I am one of the biggest fans of conjuration, specifically atronachs (or any non-undead summons), and sometimes it isn't as clear cut as them having no penalty. On Novice - Adept, fire atronachs can one hit lowly bandits with their missiles, but when upped, I notice it takes quite a few fiery bolts.
I understand your feelings and agree on the cheap feeling of taking followers. I for one usually never, ever take followers. Sometimes I will take Faendal or Uthgerd on the first few quests, but then I kick them to the curb. Most of my characters go solo, so I do have to play without their crutch.
I think all in all, it is a big advantage to have a tank fighting with you but it isn't my style. I much prefer being on my own even if that means having atronachs being summoned from Oblivion. It really does come down to character play styles. Some builds or skill combinations will do much better at higher levels in my experience. A stray arrow hitting a low defense flesh spell mage is the ultimate doom while a heavy defensive shield user is my favorite kind to take on the pumped up baddies of Skyrim.
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I won't touch legendary John...
The numbers really don't add up for me, it makes too many skills feel useless.
If I hose a bandit with flames I want it to go down. I don't like that I have to grind my skills so high to drop enemies in a realistic way.
Honestly, I've never tried it, not once. Master feels just right for me. Maybe if I tried it I'd enjoy the challenge but others here on the site have put me off...
I think it's those archers. I really don't like being one-shot and some of them can give me a hard time on master...
Don't you go feeling guilty about those followers/summons, it's not our fault that Bethesda chose such an unimaginitive way of conducting game difficulty...
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I've played the paladin on legendary.
It was not fun - not because I was dying too much, but because I wasn't dying at all! - Even the mighty ebony warrior fell in less than 2 minutes and kaarstag couldn't kill my character! I was too overpowered - and without any exploit - but that was after level 60 and when I hit the armor and the block cap (and I was nearly immune to magic - Atronach stone + Perk) -
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I really don't think the Legendary Mode was made to be played FROM THE VERY START. I mean, you could, of course, but from Master to Legendary difficulties the tactic is either have someone else tank the damage (summon, zombie, or follower) or play a sneaky character. Another technique is kiting. This is of course only applicable with ranged characters, both mundane and arcane, but this won't be so effective against multiple opponents early on. Also, if you're playing a strictly melee character, you could use the surroundings to your advantage. Find chokepoints (dungeons are perfect for this tactic) and lure them in, so that you could fight them one at a time. This is effective on the spider you were fighting, because he's too big to fit on the entrance. Not so on draugrs or people. But then you could just bash them to death (its boring though
).I've played Mason's Arcane Archer on Legendary mode once, when it was released. By then I was already 50-ish. As you can imagine, most opponents I encounter are already dead long before the get close to me. But if I get hit, its still a bit painful, but nothing I can't handle. I only get hit when I'm fighting dragons.
I don't do jumping to places the npcs can't go. Yeah, it looks awesome and feels tactical. But I only like it if its a large-scale battle. Even then I don't do it.
Oh, and the dungeon you were thinking of is called Bleak Falls Barrow.
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