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Legion

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Legion

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November 14, 2018 2:56 PM EST

in the topic Fallout 76 Has Me Worried For The Next Elder Scrolls in the forum Elder Scrolls

Rogue said: The fiasco of 76 honestly has me worried that Bethesda will attempt to reuse the Creation Engine (which I know will be modified to hell, but modding can only do so much, as proven by 76) for Starfield and TES6. From Todd himself: “For Fallout 76 we have changed a lot,” Todd Howard told Gamestar this year. “The game uses a new renderer, a new lighting system and a new system for the landscape generation. For Starfield even more of it changes. And for The Elder Scrolls 6, out there on the horizon even more. We like our editor. It allows us to create worlds really fast and the modders know it really well. There are some elementary ways we create our games and that will continue because that lets us be efficient and we think it works best.” Links Apparently Todd now thinks the Creation Engine can be upgraded and pushed far enough to support ES6. This post was edited by Legion at November 14, 2018 2:56 PM EST
November 14, 2018 2:45 PM EST

in the topic Oh Bethesda, what is you doin in the forum Fallout

Golden Fool said: So before I you read any further I just wanted to say that I'm not trying to make you like the game, all I've tried to do here is respond to some points with my own views based on what I've played. Legion said: I haven't, but it's probably just my own preference that I can't stand exposition delivered through tapes, notes, etc. That's been a staple in gaming for far too long. It's lazy at best, immersion-breaking at worst. There's no belivability in people stopping to write notes for no one in particular, especially during times of crisis. Most of the notes/holotapes I've found were either written/recorded before the bombs or years after so they aren't exactly in "times of crisis". I've found holotapes where a group were detailing their progress through what is effectivally a practical exam that the Responders hold for their combat devision, or the tapes that DB linked to are done specifically to leave a record of what it was like following the bombs so that future generations have an understanding of it and was something people volunteered to do. The holotapes for quests I've followed are instructions left for people to undergo training in case the Responders aren't available. I can't speak for all of the notes in the game since I focused mainly on the North-Eastern part of the map, but those I have read have/give their reasons for existing. Also exposition can be just as bad if not worse when done poorly with actual characters since games will often just have the person start spewing information which is not how most people talk. I can accept a note/letter or book doing it since they are designed to provide information (sometimes detailed). Right, fair enough, I was over-generalizing and generally talking out of my ass. And good point about the spoken exposition. Poorly written is poorly written, no matter how it's delivered. Legion said: I hope it works in practice then, because having no NPCs sounds like a terrible idea, especially for the writing. There's a world of difference between reading information from a note, and having that information spoken to you by a character. If you don't know who's speaking the words, and in what way, they just won't be as effective. Did you ever play or hear anyone talking about Journey? If you haven't it was a game with no NPCs and it was widely loved. Having no NPCs can work amazingly if written well, I just doubt Bethesda is capable of that. So I agree that it wasn't their greatest idea. The voiced holotapes are about as close as you can get to having the person standing in front of you just without animations. You can ask why then don't they just have humans standing in front of you, good question and I think the point is that we as the players are supposed to be the humans who are rebuilding. It's naive of Bethesda to think that people in an online game wont just be dicks to each other but based on the Beta it seems to be working, whether this continues after release is another thing. Overall it requires a different style of writting for this to work. I'd also argue against it being "lazy" since it requires a lot of effort to make it work, now whether Bethesda has managed that is another question that there will be differing opinions on. I'm making this point exceptionally poorly. I originally said this: No game that relies on exposition dumps to tell its story can be considered good writing. which was a fucking stupid way to express a thought I hadn't fully put together yet. What I'm trying to say is that by removing NPCs from the game, it removes a part of the world that's always been there. It takes away sources of exposition and world building that have always been present. So now I don't know how to respond to your other thread, cause I don't know if NPCs are part of what defines a Fallout game. But anyway, good points, lots to think about.
November 13, 2018 1:40 AM EST

in the topic How can you go around the main quest in Fallout 4? in the forum Fallout

Mr. Edd said: Thanks, I'll look into this mod. Maybe with the no voiced protagonist + full dialogue mod Fallout 4 becomes more palatable to me. I (still) want to enjoy the game, somehow. I quite like this alternate start mod, and I think you will too if only for the fact that it lets you choose traits. I went with my classic Four Eyes and Trigger Discipline for my first run with it. I also think Full Dialogue Interface will be a huge help. * It lets you see exactly what you'll say before you say it. Combined with the Silent Protagonist mod, it's almost feels like you have a choice. There's still the occasional annoyance of having to choose from 4 practically identical answers, but I don't think there's much fixing that. *Edit: Got excited and forgot you mentioned it. This post was edited by Legion at November 13, 2018 1:40 AM EST
November 13, 2018 1:27 AM EST

in the topic Oh Bethesda, what is you doin in the forum Fallout

Dragonborn2021 said: I actually have no problem with the new style of questing and storytelling in theory. Of course it's possible that Bethesda will completly fuck it up but I don't think that there's a fundamental problem with the idea. It's actually a rather interesting style that I think could. Could. Add to the experience of playing a Fallout game in a new interesting way. The idea behind it is solid, and with the proper care could be something fascinating, it can create a level of mystery and exploration for each quest that I think games are missing, and to be honest most of the best writing in F4 is in the Terminal Entries, Notes and some of the Holotapes. So...look I'm not going to stand here and say that it's perfect or that Bethesda probably won't fuck it up, but I think it's an interesting idea that could work if Bethesda had the right writers. From what I've seen of playthroughs, it's worked rather well in the early stages of the game. It might be a bit tougher later on or on multiple playthroughs (which is a huge flaw of the system) but...yeah I'm interested and enjoying what I've seen so far. On top of that, as Goldie mentioned, I think that Fallout 76 is going to depend somewhat on the player in the same way Skyrim (which I think has some pretty terrible writing most of the time) has. It's an experiment...Bethesda's been pretty open about that, and while they totally fucked up by both making it full price and the entire BETA experience, at least as far as I'm concerned...it's still interesting enough that I'm willing to play it. Not paying anywhere near full price, we've got a deal going down here where I trade in 2 games and get it for $29 (with the base price being $100 in Australia) and that's the only reason I'm paying for it now instead of waiting to see what it's like. Because yeah, this really could be a huge fuck up on every level, I don't fully trust Bethesda's writing to bridge the gap enough, but I'm willing to see what it's like. I hope it works in practice then, because having no NPCs sounds like a terrible idea, especially for the writing. There's a world of difference between reading information from a note, and having that information spoken to you by a character. If you don't know who's speaking the words, and in what way, they just won't be as effective. It's like if you found Ulfric's "I fight because I must" speech scrawled on some note in an empty castle in an empty town. That moment would be gone. The note would preclude that moment. You'll have learned what Ulfric said, but not felt it, not experienced it. If I wanted to learn about what happened before I got here, I'd pick up a history book. Luckily Skyrim has both history books and events actively happening in the world around you. I just can't imagine a good story emerging from wandering from one location to the next with no direction beyond whatever messages you find left behind and no characters to add any tension or flavor to the experience. This really isn't a Fallout game. It's a McDonalds toy called Vault Lad.
November 13, 2018 12:58 AM EST

in the topic Oh Bethesda, what is you doin in the forum Fallout

Decumus Scotti said: Have you ever played Subnautica? No NPCs and I have to say one of the most fascinating games I’ve ever played. Passive storytelling can be really powerful. Subnautica only used voice messages and datapads to tell it’s story and it was pretty awesome. I haven't, but it's probably just my own preference that I can't stand exposition delivered through tapes, notes, etc. That's been a staple in gaming for far too long. It's lazy at best, immersion-breaking at worst. There's no belivability in people stopping to write notes for no one in particular, especially during times of crisis.

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