Elder Scrolls Lore » Discussions


Lore: Argonians and Grummites

  • June 15, 2016

    Nevertheless,  I think this thing with Gnarls is just genius. Another piece of puzzle to Sheogorath who seems much more than he is again.

    Edit: And yeah, you are right. Isles are calling me. I feel like going home right now and launching Oblivion just to jump througj Anne Marie's mouth to Blessed Isles.
  • June 15, 2016

    It's mentioned in Infernal City so I'm not sure there is any pictures unfortunately

  • Member
    June 15, 2016

    And those butterflies! Man, the butterflies

  • Member
    June 15, 2016

    I don't know if there's a picture but it's mentioned in some of the lore.

    I have two theories about those pieces of art:

    We know the Hist sap has the capabilities to change the Argonain's physical form, therefore we can suggest these tree-like argonians are probably individuals who may have had a bit to much sap.

    The more likely interpretation in my eyes would be that it is a symbolism to depict those that have a very strong connection with the hist, therefore being almost one with the tree. A different interpretation would be that this how the argonians used to represent their souls, seeing they believe their souls return to the hist to be united with the trees as one.

  • June 15, 2016
    So we can only guess how it looks. In my opinion it can mean only two things. One is thag Argonians really were partially trees. Second, more probable option, would be that it's a metaphor for Argonians and their symbiosis with Hist. You know, like paintings of old Native Americans. When you don't have a written language, pictures have to speak insted of it. Emotions, events...everything in one picture. Paintings are more probable to contain metaphors than most written texts.
  • June 15, 2016
    Ha! Synchronized! xD
  • June 15, 2016
    Everytime I play Shivering Isles I habe butterflies in my stomach... xD
  • Member
    June 15, 2016

    Yep, and better yet almost complementary information:

    You explain why they would have symbolisms, I give different interpretations of said symbolims.

    It's all just great

  • June 15, 2016

    There is far to many coincidences in this for it not be true and as we know there is no such thing as coincidences in the Mundus anymore. The Grummites and the trees in Shivering Isles have to be related to the Argonians and the Hist in some way, whether they are ancestors or another breed since we know there are other types of Hists in other realms of Oblivion. Also it's worth noting that the Paraatru tribe of Argonians from inner Black Marsh are described as being "toad-like".

    I am still trying to nail down my interpretation of Sithis\Sithisit\Hist. Sithis being the Inexpressible Action, I see that as meaning the subconscious or instinct. In other words what the scientist would call the "Lizard Brain"

    To quote Seth Godin:

    “The lizard brain is hungry, scared, angry, and horny.

    The lizard brain only wants to eat and be safe.

    The lizard brain will fight (to the death) if it has to, but would rather run away. It likes a vendetta and has no trouble getting angry.

    The lizard brain cares what everyone else thinks, because status in the tribe is essential to its survival.A squirrel runs around looking for nuts, hiding from foxes, listening for predators, and watching for other squirrels. The squirrel does this because that's all it can do. All the squirrel has is a lizard brain.

    The only correct answer to 'Why did the chicken cross the road?' is 'Because it's lizard brain told it to.'

    Wild animals are wild because the only brain they posses is a lizard brain.

    The lizard brain is not merely a concept. It's real, and it's living on the top of your spine, fighting for your survival.

    But, of course, survival and success are not the same thing.The lizard brain is the reason you're afraid, the reason you don't do all the art you can, the reason you don't ship when you can. The lizard brain is the source of the resistance.”

     I could see the Argonians revering (but not worshiping) this beacuse it's what allowed them to survive whereas other races would see it limiting there civility.

  • Member
    June 15, 2016

    If Sithis is the instinct of the argonians, then it would make sense the Hist is their "civility". We know they have a deep connection to the argonians, going as deep as sharing thoughts in some situations, and some scholars in Nirn seem to believe the Argonians were made by the Hist. It is said the Hist elevated them from simple lizards to what they are now. What if this meant that instead of them actually being lizards, it means it "freed" them from the "Lizard brain", from their instinctive nature and allowed them to grow into a civilisation?

    It's just a thougth but who knows, it might help you.