Elder Scrolls Lore » Discussions

Shor, Son of Shor

• Paws

  

  Member
   

  October 14, 2014

  Sorry for leaving that dangling Shaun.

  I mean, we have a tendency to view all these gods as being different, which in a sense is right. But when we get right down to it and look at the wheel, there are only eight spokes. So at the beginning of Shor Son of Shor, Tsun grabs Dibella and Stun drags her into the tent. At the end it is Trinimac who leaves the tent.

  Sorry for leaving that dangling Shaun.

  I mean, we have a tendency to view all these gods as being different, which in a sense is right. But when we get right down to it and look at the wheel, there are only eight spokes. So at the beginning of Shor Son of Shor, Tsun grabs Dibella and Stun drags her into the tent. At the end it is Trinimac who leaves the tent.

• Alastor

  

  Member
   

  October 14, 2014

  Jumping back to 4th era, if the kalpa defeats Alduin then the world wouldn't end. The Dragonborn won so what happens now? Or am I interpreting differently? I also enjoyed the Dwemer artifacts reference: keening, hammerclap (sunder), guard his wraith (wraithguard) leading up to the removal of his heart. How did the godless Dwemer get tied up in this? Everytime he talks of Ald (Alduin) I think of Auriel. Especially the Trinimac reference, bridging that pantheon differentiation. This is a fantastic article guys, really got me thinking.

  Jumping back to 4th era, if the kalpa defeats Alduin then the world wouldn't end. The Dragonborn won so what happens now? Or am I interpreting differently? I also enjoyed the Dwemer artifacts reference: keening, hammerclap (sunder), guard his wraith (wraithguard) leading up to the removal of his heart. How did the godless Dwemer get tied up in this? Everytime he talks of Ald (Alduin) I think of Auriel. Especially the Trinimac reference, bridging that pantheon differentiation. This is a fantastic article guys, really got me thinking.
• Deleted Member

  
   

  October 14, 2014

  Question: Isn't all of Kirkbride's stuff after Morrowind "fanfiction?" I feel like he's just writing stuff to make people mad/confused now. 

  Question: Isn't all of Kirkbride's stuff after Morrowind "fanfiction?" I feel like he's just writing stuff to make people mad/confused now. 

• Paws

  

  Member
   

  October 14, 2014

  Have a look at the FAQ and Resources (a work in progress) in which I started to compile a list of books written by MK in-game, along with a few reasons why I believe his work is valid. Basically, you can't discuss religion or metaphysics in TES without having to reference Kirkbride - he wrote everything about that stuff. Surely what he has to say is still relevant, despite not having the Todd Howard seal of approval?

  Have a look at the FAQ and Resources (a work in progress) in which I started to compile a list of books written by MK in-game, along with a few reasons why I believe his work is valid. Basically, you can't discuss religion or metaphysics in TES without having to reference Kirkbride - he wrote everything about that stuff. Surely what he has to say is still relevant, despite not having the Todd Howard seal of approval?

• Paws

  

  Member
   

  October 14, 2014

  I also enjoyed the Dwemer artifacts reference: keening, hammerclap (sunder), guard his wraith (wraithguard) leading up to the removal of his heart. How did the godless Dwemer get tied up in this?

  That's a wonderful spot Alastor, I'd never made that connection before. It's probably connected to the Battle of Red Mountain which has all sorts of mythic overtones. The whole thing is a re-enactment of convention and I'm still having to get my head around it to some extent but I think the line in The Five Songs of King Wulfharth has some relevance:

  Then Wulfharth said: “Don't you see where you really are? Don't you know who Shor really is? Don't you know what this war is?” And they looked from the King to the God to the Devils and Orcs, and some knew, really knew, and they are the ones that stayed.

  I also enjoyed the Dwemer artifacts reference: keening, hammerclap (sunder), guard his wraith (wraithguard) leading up to the removal of his heart. How did the godless Dwemer get tied up in this?

  That's a wonderful spot Alastor, I'd never made that connection before. It's probably connected to the Battle of Red Mountain which has all sorts of mythic overtones. The whole thing is a re-enactment of convention and I'm still having to get my head around it to some extent but I think the line in The Five Songs of King Wulfharth has some relevance:

  Then Wulfharth said: “Don't you see where you really are? Don't you know who Shor really is? Don't you know what this war is?” And they looked from the King to the God to the Devils and Orcs, and some knew, really knew, and they are the ones that stayed.

• Deleted Member

  
   

  October 14, 2014

  I'm going to go with this guy's nuts, and I don't really like/ believe his nonsense. Now, that is said because I like my lore concrete, and not this "anything goes dragon break stuff." 

  Also, I think his stuff is taken too literal. It seems rife with symbilosms.

  I'm going to go with this guy's nuts, and I don't really like/ believe his nonsense. Now, that is said because I like my lore concrete, and not this "anything goes dragon break stuff." 

  Also, I think his stuff is taken too literal. It seems rife with symbilosms.

• Tom

  

  Member
   

  October 14, 2014

  I never heard of Red Mountain being a reenactment of Convention. Could you elaborate on that?

  I never heard of Red Mountain being a reenactment of Convention. Could you elaborate on that?

• Paws

  

  Member
   

  October 14, 2014

  Fair enough Shor, I respect your opinion although I think you're missing out by excluding it. If you like your lore "concrete" how do you cope with TES lore in general? Is it like this  ?

  Your opinion is the reason we have a rule which says discussions like this are fine, provided we don't use assertions from such work to back up theories/arguments. 

  Fair enough Shor, I respect your opinion although I think you're missing out by excluding it. If you like your lore "concrete" how do you cope with TES lore in general? Is it like this  ?

  Your opinion is the reason we have a rule which says discussions like this are fine, provided we don't use assertions from such work to back up theories/arguments. 

• Paws

  

  Member
   

  October 14, 2014

  Hell, I don't know if I can but I'll try.

  The presence of Shor at Red Mountain is exceedingly important I think. There are also references to Dumac Dwarf-Orc and Dumalcath in Five Songs. Now, the references to Orc in this guy's name can't be ignored. I reckon he is fulfilling Trinimac's role (who later becomes an Orc of course) in the interplay.

  Dumac's Hammer, Sunder, strikes The Heart of Lorkhan in an event which copies Trinimac's removal of Lorkhan's heart.

  Hell, I don't know if I can but I'll try.

  The presence of Shor at Red Mountain is exceedingly important I think. There are also references to Dumac Dwarf-Orc and Dumalcath in Five Songs. Now, the references to Orc in this guy's name can't be ignored. I reckon he is fulfilling Trinimac's role (who later becomes an Orc of course) in the interplay.

  Dumac's Hammer, Sunder, strikes The Heart of Lorkhan in an event which copies Trinimac's removal of Lorkhan's heart.

• Chris

  

  Member
   

  October 15, 2014

  So, wait, were Tsun/Stuhn going to practice the "Dibellan Arts" with Dibella herself, but Trinimac didn't want to go through with it?

  So, wait, were Tsun/Stuhn going to practice the "Dibellan Arts" with Dibella herself, but Trinimac didn't want to go through with it?