The Elder Scrolls Online » Discussions


Stamina Builds Lack Diversity? Recommend a Build!

  • Member
    August 13, 2018

    Whenever I start a new character in ESO, I always face the same dillemma: Stamina or Magicka? It's a decision that can be absolutely frustrating, especially if that character is going to be there for the long haul. It's also a decision that effects other players, potentially, as it's always important to bear in mind a team's enjoyment if I plan on taking the character into Group content.

    As a general rule I favour Stamina - swords and armour always fire my imagination more than robes and wood. Yet I can't shake the fact that Magicka builds are simply more diverse and appealing in terms of having their own identity.

    It's like, want to make a Stamplar Damage-Dealer? Cool! Go Redguard, Dual-Wield and Bow. Slot Endless Hail, Poison Injection, Caltrops, Rearming Trap on your bow bar; slot Rending Slashes, Killer's Blade, and Surprise atack on your dual-Wield bar.

    Wanna make a Stamina DK damage-dealer? Cool, go Redguard DW and Bow. Slot Endless Hail, Poison Injection, Caltrops, Rearming Trap on your bow bar; slot Rending Slashes, Killer's Blade, and Surprise atack on your dual-Wield bar. 

    Or whatever, you get what I mean. There maybe one or two slots left on each bar for class skills that, for me, hold the class' and character's identity.

    Whereas Magicka builds tend to have a lot more diversity and way more identity. Elemental Blockade is pretty ubiquitous for any staff-wielder, but other than that the front and back bars can be loaded with class skills. This gives a Magicka Dk a very different experience and feel to a Magicka Warden and can really make a character feel unique.

    I think there is growing support for more Barbarian-type builds with Two-Handed becoming more popular, but again it's a weapon skill rather than a class skill. I have great fun with Rally, Reverse Slice, and Brawler but already that's three weapon skills on my bar - apart from RP there is litle to distinguish my Khajiit Stam DK from my Nord Stam Warden. One is a bit more knightly, the other more primal. I enjoy them both, and each class has enough identity to keep them unique, but there is a very real risk that playing this way effect the enjoyment of other players later in the game.

    For me that's an issue. Even though I prefer solo content and self-sufficient setups, sometimes I do want to go into a vet dungeon or run through a trial with guildies. So until such a time as some sort of toggled passive is introduced to allow melee weapons to restore magicka and staves to restore stamina, scaling damage off of their opposing attribute, it looks like Mag-based characters will continue to be more diverse...

    ...Or, I'm looking at the wrong builds. PVP builds appear to have more diversity as they tend to be more self-reliant. It  appears that in PVP builds there is no stigma attached to slotting a staff on one bar and a sword and shield on the other, investing into all three attributes.

    So I thought, now the Wolfhunter patch has landed and bringing with it all those changes in Update 19,  we could use this thread for build inspirations and up-to-date ideas from meta PVE and PVP to casual solo builds. Just an inspiration and setup-sharing thread :)

    Resources:

    Deltia's Gaming Battleground Bully series

    Alcast HQ

    Dotz Gaming

  • August 13, 2018

    Awww, makes me wonder how against type can you go in ESO?

    Unfortunately, I can't really help you. My one character, Fat Khajiit, didn't go beyond level 5 or 6 and he drove Karver and Mirric crazy with this slowness. 

    Hope someone WAY better can help you with this. 

  • Member
    August 13, 2018

    The Long-Chapper said:

    Awww, makes me wonder how against type can you go in ESO?

    Unfortunately, I can't really help you. My one character, Fat Khajiit, didn't go beyond level 5 or 6 and he drove Karver and Mirric crazy with this slowness. 

    Hope someone WAY better can help you with this. 

    Thanks Lis :D Yay to fat kitties!

    In truth you can play how you want. Like, my Khajiit Dragonknight can hold his own in pretty much any, more casual, experience. Soloing Public Dungeons, Dolmens, Abyssal Geysers, and quite a few world bosses means he's self sufficient in the same way a normal Skyrim build is. That is to say, I can experience anything in a zone and have fun on my own or in a group if I take him to Normal Dungeons. 

    However, i couldn't take him into a Vet Dungeon as a damage dealer. He just isn't pulling high enough numbers to be as effective as an optimised build,something which could limit the enjoyment of others in a team. He could probably tank it with a quick change of gear, but would ned a bit more healer suport than a specialised tank.

    It's just one of those things with ESO - like, a player needs to decide what content they plan a character for and bear in mind its limitations if Group content is a concideration. For a new player, these things are less important than going out and just having fun. Once a player has a few characters, the question needs to be, "what is this character for?" Yet it's not set in stone, one can respec and chnage/evolve so I am probably just over-thinking as is normal :D

    For the thread, I have been using Alcast HQ for guidance on what the top-level meta is on various classes.

    I've also started looking into Dotz Gaming for a fresh perspective.

  • August 13, 2018

    Paws said:

    The Long-Chapper said:

    Awww, makes me wonder how against type can you go in ESO?

    Unfortunately, I can't really help you. My one character, Fat Khajiit, didn't go beyond level 5 or 6 and he drove Karver and Mirric crazy with this slowness. 

    Hope someone WAY better can help you with this. 

    Thanks Lis :D Yay to fat kitties!

    In truth you can play how you want. Like, my Khajiit Dragonknight can hold his own in pretty much any, more casual, experience. Soloing Public Dungeons, Dolmens, Abyssal Geysers, and quite a few world bosses means he's self sufficient in the same way a normal Skyrim build is. That is to say, I can experience anything in a zone and have fun on my own or in a group if I take him to Normal Dungeons. 

    However, i couldn't take him into a Vet Dungeon as a damage dealer. He just isn't pulling high enough numbers to be as effective as an optimised build,something which could limit the enjoyment of others in a team. He could probably tank it with a quick change of gear, but would ned a bit more healer suport than a specialised tank.

    It's just one of those things with ESO - like, a player needs to decide what content they plan a character for and bear in mind its limitations if Group content is a concideration. For a new player, these things are less important than going out and just having fun. Once a player has a few characters, the question needs to be, "what is this character for?" Yet it's not set in stone, one can respec and chnage/evolve so I am probably just over-thinking as is normal :D

    For the thread, I have been using Alcast HQ for guidance on what the top-level meta is on various classes.

    I've also started looking into Dotz Gaming for a fresh perspective.

    That's the one thing that's so intimidating about ESO for me. Yeah, I could definitely make fun things for me to play on my own, but to function in a group, and I love the idea of teamplaying, but I wouldn't know what people would want or need. I've heard that PS4 is short healers, so probably my second character would be a healer that could do the job effectively for a group effectively. 

  • Member
    August 13, 2018

    The Long-Chapper said:

    That's the one thing that's so intimidating about ESO for me. Yeah, I could definitely make fun things for me to play on my own, but to function in a group, and I love the idea of teamplaying, but I wouldn't know what people would want or need. I've heard that PS4 is short healers, so probably my second character would be a healer that could do the job effectively for a group effectively. 

    Skyrim needs more healers!

    It's definitely worth saying that you can experience hundreds (if not thousands) of hours worth of content without ever having to worry about any of the stuff in this thread. Absolutely, definitely and completely you can roll a character from any race, use any class, and have an absolute blast :) As a single-player game, it's loaded with great story-quests, a ton of delves to enjoy, and more solo content in the form of dlc's. Honestly, you need not worry about just having fun. Even if you take that character and team up with a few others, you can expereince and enjoy most base-game group dungeons.

    ^Indeed, that's pretty much what I enjoy most.

    It's only really veteran content and trials where min/maxing starts to become an issue.

  • Member
    August 13, 2018

    I have a "Pure Poison" DK that I've been planning lately. It uses a Poison Infused Bow bar with Noxious Breath, Resolving Vigor, Lethal Arrow, Acid Spray, Poison Injection, and Toxic Barrage, and a Poison Infused/Disease Infused DW bar with Noxious Breath (couldn't figure out what else I wanted here), Resolving Vigor, Whirling Blades, Venomous Claw, Flying Blade, and Corrosive Armor. My sets are Velidreth, Sheer Venom, and Viper's Sting. The whole gist of the build is poison, poison, and more poison.

  • Member
    August 14, 2018

    Ebonslayer said:

    I have a "Pure Poison" DK that I've been planning lately. It uses a Poison Infused Bow bar with Noxious Breath, Resolving Vigor, Lethal Arrow, Acid Spray, Poison Injection, and Toxic Barrage, and a Poison Infused/Disease Infused DW bar with Noxious Breath (couldn't figure out what else I wanted here), Resolving Vigor, Whirling Blades, Venomous Claw, Flying Blade, and Corrosive Armor. My sets are Velidreth, Sheer Venom, and Viper's Sting. The whole gist of the build is poison, poison, and more poison.

    I think that's a sound idea, doubly so if you use poisons on the weapons! I look forward to seeing how it develops, Ebon. Are you going for a stam-friendly race like a Redguard or Bosmer, or ignoring that for a race more off-meta?

    You've reminded me of another of my gripes: the difference between a stam DK and its magicka counterpart. Best race for a mag DK would likely be Dunmer because of their flame damage passive and overall magicka boosts, yet by making the stamina morph of a couple of DK abilities deal poison damage, the variety of options feel somewhat lessened. If Fiery Breath, Searing Strike, and even Lava Whip had a stamina morph but also retained their flame damage, I can't help but feel we'd see more diversity.

    I'm not certain of that and so could be talking out of my backside, but a Dunmer stam Dk could then become a strong option.

  • Member
    August 14, 2018

    Paws said:

    I think that's a sound idea, doubly so if you use poisons on the weapons! I look forward to seeing how it develops, Ebon. Are you going for a stam-friendly race like a Redguard or Bosmer, or ignoring that for a race more off-meta?

    Probably Argonian, because #masterrace.

    Paws said:

    You've reminded me of another of my gripes: the difference between a stam DK and its magicka counterpart. Best race for a mag DK would likely be Dunmer because of their flame damage passive and overall magicka boosts, yet by making the stamina morph of a couple of DK abilities deal poison damage, the variety of options feel somewhat lessened. If Fiery Breath, Searing Strike, and even Lava Whip had a stamina morph but also retained their flame damage, I can't help but feel we'd see more diversity.

    I'm not certain of that and so could be talking out of my backside, but a Dunmer stam Dk could then become a strong option.

    For those moments I just go completely off-meta and make a hybrid. Yes, they're usually not that great compared to the average "pure" build, but they're not as bad as people make them seem to be. A good hybrid stacking weapon damage with Pelinal's Aptitude and a good rotation is a monster with amazing sustain, not as much damage as a pure due to split magicka/stamina, but they never stop.

     

  • Member
    August 14, 2018

    Ebonslayer said:

    For those moments I just go completely off-meta and make a hybrid. Yes, they're usually not that great compared to the average "pure" build, but they're not as bad as people make them seem to be. A good hybrid stacking weapon damage with Pelinal's Aptitude and a good rotation is a monster with amazing sustain, not as much damage as a pure due to split magicka/stamina, but they never stop.

    Interesting. I've never used Pelinal's Aptitude, will need to look into it in more detail. I can't shake the feeling that it would need something more. In theory a stamina-focussed build with a high weapon damage could use their magicka abilities more effectively, but damage is also calculated based on max stamnina or magicka.

    So, and I might be wrong here, but I'm imagining a Stam DK with all points into stamina hitting with a sword. Let's say he has 2800 weapon damage. If he then uses Molton Whip, he still won't be doing as much damage as his sword would because of his low magicka pool, and would likely be better hitting with a weapon rather than wasting that magicka when it could be used for Green Dragon Blood for healing.

    Still, I imagine if wearing Prismatic Defence Glyphs on every piece of armour that it could be a really fun and viable build option to showcase the skills a DK has at her disposal. An absolute blast in solo pve, I bet!

    I thought I'd share this little gem I bookmarked back in May, a fun and interesting read for off-meta but fun PVE builds :)

  • Member
    August 14, 2018

    Paws said:

    Interesting. I've never used Pelinal's Aptitude, will need to look into it in more detail. I can't shake the feeling that it would need something more. In theory a stamina-focussed build with a high weapon damage could use their magicka abilities more effectively, but damage is also calculated based on max stamnina or magicka.

    So, and I might be wrong here, but I'm imagining a Stam DK with all points into stamina hitting with a sword. Let's say he has 2800 weapon damage. If he then uses Molton Whip, he still won't be doing as much damage as his sword would because of his low magicka pool, and would likely be better hitting with a weapon rather than wasting that magicka when it could be used for Green Dragon Blood for healing.

    Still, I imagine if wearing Prismatic Defence Glyphs on every piece of armour that it could be a really fun and viable build option to showcase the skills a DK has at her disposal. An absolute blast in solo pve, I bet!

    I thought I'd share this little gem I bookmarked back in May, a fun and interesting read for off-meta but fun PVE builds :)

    Yeah, a stamina or magicka build can't just throw on Pelinal's Aptitude and become proficient in the other tree. Depending on how well they stack damage, they can get pretty good damage, but the pools are a big factor in damage. Every 1k attribute points is equivalent to 100 weapon or spell damage.

    Another weakness I forgot to mention is they basically lose crits as they'd need to focus on building both magic and weapon crit chance, and typically a hybrid will focus on proc sets or stacking weapon damage or magicka/stamina to empower their abilities, they also need to split Champion Points as well. However, hybrids do have some other things going for them, such as the nearly infinite sustain I mentioned earlier, and you'll never find a better debuffer or DOT specialist, as they have access to all that their weapon and class skills can give, a hybrid Nightblade is especially dangerous for this reason as they have a shitton of debuffs and DOTs, there's even a DOT focused HybridBlade PVP build that can outdamage a DK tank's healing, damage shields, and resistances with their rotation. Hybrids also make amazing werewolves right now as their weapon damage will power their offensive abilities and with a good build they can make Hircine's Bounty one of the best heals in the game, though this will change with Wolfhunter as the heal will be based on max health.