Elder Scrolls Lore » Discussions


Research: Elsweyr

Tags: #ESO 
  • June 12, 2019

    Life is too short to wait or worry about eventuality, especially when it comes to creativity. That feeling of building, of following a new idea and all the excitement that brings is more important than the destination. Follow the muse, feel don't think, train the mind for clarity and the soul for victory. Move as the wind, bend lke the river, follow that star no matter how far xD

    URGH, but there's so many ideas. A few of them (listed below) really made me think that Unarmed would be an incredible idea for the character, and it spawned a fun little magic Punch-Kitty that's really fun. But some of these new ones have inspired concepts of regular seeming Blades-y builds (all the Sword-and-Board style skills with Speech for shouting) and even an Assassin. Might end up being something like Agents of Org... and end up as a build that follows multiple characters with binding concepts and SHOUTING!

    Your right though, just gotta tell my brain to shut up and play something. I can get to the thinking when the build is looking more solid. Already spent like, 20 minutes debating whether I'd worship Alkosh or Riddle-Thar in my game, so, yeah decision making is clearly a strength of mine :P

    I'm sure TIL have them but, now you mention meaning of the placements, I'm going to dive back into the shrine and see. Plus, I'm missing one tablet so will grab that shot too. Here's the rest:]

    Actually couldn't find them with a quick search, though probably not the best idea to just look for the name of the location. What are they actually called? I'll be sorta pleased if the placement does mean something but it'll be sorta hilarious. 

  • Member
    June 12, 2019

    Dragonborn2121 said:

    Life is too short to wait or worry about eventuality, especially when it comes to creativity. That feeling of building, of following a new idea and all the excitement that brings is more important than the destination. Follow the muse, feel don't think, train the mind for clarity and the soul for victory. Move as the wind, bend lke the river, follow that star no matter how far xD

    URGH, but there's so many ideas. A few of them (listed below) really made me think that Unarmed would be an incredible idea for the character, and it spawned a fun little magic Punch-Kitty that's really fun. But some of these new ones have inspired concepts of regular seeming Blades-y builds (all the Sword-and-Board style skills with Speech for shouting) and even an Assassin. Might end up being something like Agents of Org... and end up as a build that follows multiple characters with binding concepts and SHOUTING!

    Your right though, just gotta tell my brain to shut up and play something. I can get to the thinking when the build is looking more solid. Already spent like, 20 minutes debating whether I'd worship Alkosh or Riddle-Thar in my game, so, yeah decision making is clearly a strength of mine :P

    I'm sure TIL have them but, now you mention meaning of the placements, I'm going to dive back into the shrine and see. Plus, I'm missing one tablet so will grab that shot too. Here's the rest:]

    Actually couldn't find them with a quick search, though probably not the best idea to just look for the name of the location. What are they actually called? I'll be sorta pleased if the placement does mean something but it'll be sorta hilarious. 

    Agent of Oegnithr? It means "bad change." Best way to remember it, I find, is to say it as Weg-nith-eer - that's how the Monks at Ceporah Tower say it, at least.

    Here's the one I missed:

    Plus the names of each one:

    You were right, their placement does carry a narrative that tells the story of the Dragonguard's retreat underground, how they had to hide, change tactics, and remain unseen to keep their eternal vigil.

    Hmm, Riddle'Thar or Alkosh? Up to you, although as we've seen the game hints that a lot of things were lost when the Riddle'Thar diverted the worship of Alkosh. If you're going in with an angle of a character preserving this ancient Akaviri stuff, maybe he also carries those pre-ri'Datta teachings with him too? There is virtually nothing on ancient Khajiiti worship of Alkosh, so you're free to go nuts. We do know they saw him as a big cat, that they themselves identified with dragons and saw them as kin, as explained by the Moon Bishop at Sunspire. In 4E Skyrim when there's dragons and shouting, a Khajiit character can have a lot of fun with that. It's a Nord thing, right? But it isn't, it's a cat thing too.

  • Member
    June 12, 2019

    Are the names of each Dragonguard Plaque also the translation of the language?

  • June 12, 2019

    Agent of Oegnithr? It means "bad change." Best way to remember it, I find, is to say it as Weg-nith-eer - that's how the Monks at Ceporah Tower say it, at least.

    Yeah, just forgot that I forgot to add the name in there :P Think it's a build that would be pretty similar in some concepts to this one

    Here's the one I missed:

    You were right, their placement does carry a narrative that tells the story of the Dragonguard's retreat underground, how they had to hide, change tactics, and remain unseen to keep their eternal vigil.

    Hah, cool glad I might have accidentally helped with a joke. I mean, just goes to show the effort that they've gone into to craft the lore for this game. 

    Hmm, Riddle'Thar or Alkosh? Up to you, although as we've seen the game hints that a lot of things were lost when the Riddle'Thar diverted the worship of Alkosh. If you're going in with an angle of a character preserving this ancient Akaviri stuff, maybe he also carries those pre-ri'Datta teachings with him too? There is virtually nothing on ancient Khajiiti worship of Alkosh, so you're free to go nuts. We do know they saw him as a big cat, that they themselves identified with dragons and saw them as kin, as explained by the Moon Bishop at Sunspire. In 4E Skyrim when there's dragons and shouting, a Khajiit character can have a lot of fun with that. It's a Nord thing, right? But it isn't, it's a cat thing too.

    I think I've basically gone with Alkosh because I think it gives me more of a chance to work in some of the new Elsweyr Lore, that and it was a better option for the character by providing Dragon Fighting buffs with Wintersun (which I keep meaning to call Wintersrun for some reason). But yeah, there's just so much I can do to make my character follow the ideal that she's a Dragon slaying Dragon in a way :P She has the voice, claws and hide of a Dragon and isn't afraid to proove that she's better than them. (when she's all levelled up because I have Deadly Dragons.)

    To answer your question about the language, it's tough to pin. I actually do see glimpses of the Dragon Tongue in there, with words like Zan, Fa, Kel, Usok, Kav, Zin, Lo, Kesn, Tel all really seeming familiar to me. There's also the grammar (or lack of anything that seems grammatical) which just isn't all that common in any language we've seen in TES other than Dragon. Elvish languages love to drop as many apostraphes as possible into their words, and tend to be a lot longer as opposed to the short length of Dragonic tongues. I guess I could also see a bit of the Khajiit language in there though, a lot of those shorter words I mentioned are present in the form of Khajiit names.

    Might give it a bit of research because fictional languages are fascinating to me :D

  • Member
    June 12, 2019

    Dragonborn2121 said:

    I think I've basically gone with Alkosh because I think it gives me more of a chance to work in some of the new Elsweyr Lore, that and it was a better option for the character by providing Dragon Fighting buffs with Wintersun (which I keep meaning to call Wintersrun for some reason). But yeah, there's just so much I can do to make my character follow the ideal that she's a Dragon slaying Dragon in a way :P She has the voice, claws and hide of a Dragon and isn't afraid to proove that she's better than them. (when she's all levelled up because I have Deadly Dragons.)

    To answer your question about the language, it's tough to pin. I actually do see glimpses of the Dragon Tongue in there, with words like Zan, Fa, Kel, Usok, Kav, Zin, Lo, Kesn, Tel all really seeming familiar to me. There's also the grammar (or lack of anything that seems grammatical) which just isn't all that common in any language we've seen in TES other than Dragon. Elvish languages love to drop as many apostraphes as possible into their words, and tend to be a lot longer as opposed to the short length of Dragonic tongues. I guess I could also see a bit of the Khajiit language in there though, a lot of those shorter words I mentioned are present in the form of Khajiit names.

    Might give it a bit of research because fictional languages are fascinating to me :D

    That's a really solid foundation, I think, and that sense of Khajiiti pride that of course she's a better dragon than they are. And she'd be right, too xD

    Yeah, I think the tablest do have a bit of dragon language there. Well spotted! Let me know what else your research turns up, it's interesting but I don't quite have the right head for researching languages so it'd be incredibly helpful if you find anything or can nail down exact words and their meaning.

  • Member
    June 12, 2019

    Couple of quick pics of the interior of the Dov-Vahl Shrine Sanctuary, thought the claw-dancer statue dominating the Dragonguard's inner sanctum might be of interest to Deebs and his project :)

    Next is the Dragonhorn. The entrance to this room is flanked on both sides by the "No faith in blade or shield by the old of Akavir" plaque:

    The Dragonhorns are pretty central to the main Elsweyr story so I don't want to go too far in. This thing is massive, but there is a portable version. We've wondered before how the Dragonguard were able to bring down dragons without a Dragonborn to shout them from the skies using Dragonrend. These horns seemed to have helped.

  • June 13, 2019

    Couple of quick pics of the interior of the Dov-Vahl Shrine Sanctuary, thought the claw-dancer statue dominating the Dragonguard's inner sanctum might be of interest to Deebs and his project :)

    Next is the Dragonhorn. The entrance to this room is flanked on both sides by the "No faith in blade or shield by the old of Akavir" plaque:

    The Dragonhorns are pretty central to the main Elsweyr story so I don't want to go too far in. This thing is massive, but there is a portable version. We've wondered before how the Dragonguard were able to bring down dragons without a Dragonborn to shout them from the skies using Dragonrend. These horns seemed to have helped.

    Very pretty looking stuff, especially the claw-dancer statue but that's because statues are the best. So, is the actual effect of the Dragonhorn a massive spoiler or is it probably something that makes a lot of sense? Would be very interested in those spoilers (since I won't be playing it for a few months, and maybe even not then) if you wanted to either message me or add a spoiler tag here. But man is it lovely, even if this particular one probably isn't particularly useful (probably) I just really like the idea of them now (without knowing more about them). 

    Yeah, I think the tablest do have a bit of dragon language there. Well spotted! Let me know what else your research turns up, it's interesting but I don't quite have the right head for researching languages so it'd be incredibly helpful if you find anything or can nail down exact words and their meaning.

    It's sorta screwing with me to be honest. I can't find any real direct translations in any of the established languages. The occasional word but it would have a vastly different meaning based on the theory that the tablets have their name written on the top (which seems to make sense, but isn't guarenteed).

    Like, if we were translating this into any of the words I can find it'd be Wind ___ ___ Kyne (only if you add another a) Told (if you took out a U). That or maybe Dosek could have some connection to the words "From", "Of", "Belonging To" since Do and Se both share those meanings, but that still doesn't make sense and requires butchering several words. I guess some of that could make sense, but has nothing to do with the following script or the name of the plate. None of the other languages really come close, but weirdly Dragon has the most words...which is a sentence that is logical.

    So yeah, I think the odds are that it's Akaviri or Tsaeci specifically, but you have me absolutely hooked on the possibility of finding more, it could be that ESO has secretly given us some really awesome stuff here. Or it's just more stuff from another language, but either way it could be interesting.

  • June 14, 2019

    Interesting read. Looks like they are ripping off A song of Ice and Fire basically with the idea of Dragonhorns. 

  • Member
    June 14, 2019

    Dragonborn2121 said:

    Very pretty looking stuff, especially the claw-dancer statue but that's because statues are the best. So, is the actual effect of the Dragonhorn a massive spoiler or is it probably something that makes a lot of sense? Would be very interested in those spoilers (since I won't be playing it for a few months, and maybe even not then) if you wanted to either message me or add a spoiler tag here. But man is it lovely, even if this particular one probably isn't particularly useful (probably) I just really like the idea of them now (without knowing more about them).

    It's sorta screwing with me to be honest. I can't find any real direct translations in any of the established languages. The occasional word but it would have a vastly different meaning based on the theory that the tablets have their name written on the top (which seems to make sense, but isn't guarenteed).

    Like, if we were translating this into any of the words I can find it'd be Wind ___ ___ Kyne (only if you add another a) Told (if you took out a U). That or maybe Dosek could have some connection to the words "From", "Of", "Belonging To" since Do and Se both share those meanings, but that still doesn't make sense and requires butchering several words. I guess some of that could make sense, but has nothing to do with the following script or the name of the plate. None of the other languages really come close, but weirdly Dragon has the most words...which is a sentence that is logical.

    So yeah, I think the odds are that it's Akaviri or Tsaeci specifically, but you have me absolutely hooked on the possibility of finding more, it could be that ESO has secretly given us some really awesome stuff here. Or it's just more stuff from another language, but either way it could be interesting.

    It sounds like progress, Deebs. You've narrowed it down enough to say it's not a language you're familiar with. Are there any common words in the tablets that would help decipher individual meanings?

    When I get more time I'll go into a bit more detail about the Dragonhorns, in addition to the reply below to Lis.

    The Long-Chapper said:

    Interesting read. Looks like they are ripping off A song of Ice and Fire basically with the idea of Dragonhorns. 

    I don't know about Song of Ice and Fire, I stopped watching it at the end of seaon six, I think. I was addicted to the show for years but there was something about it that depressed the hell out of me, too. The two last straws were Hodor and the burning of the little girl at the stake. I was just like "I can't, not anymore." Idk why, just knocked me on my arse for ages and I didn't want to go back in after I'd picked myself up.

    I admit the idea of the Dragonhorn felt a bit like deus ex machina to me at first. We're introduced to them in the tutorial so they're there from the start but it felt a bit weird. After some thought, though, they made perfect sense. I mean, Skyrim expanded our knowledge of the Dragonguard massively to the point we could look at what dragons they'd slain, but how they did it felt a bit glossed over, I guess. We get a poxy blessing from Esbern and are expected to believe that some old dude can mumble a few words and we, plus our one or two Blades buddies, are going to bring down a dragon with some shitty weapons. I never quite understood why the dragons wouldn't fly away, either. Before we get Dragonrend we're led to believe it's pride keeping them in the fight. So it was a bit of a stretch for me imagining these creatures all had a death wish and none were smart enough to fly away against an army of Akaviri Dragonguard warriors.

    All that said, we also knew these same Dragonguard had already wiped out the dragons back home and came to Skyrim and Cyrodiil in search of a Dragonborn. So they didn't have a shouter who could use dragonrend and yet still managed to bring down loads of dragons anyway. From that perspective, the horn sort of makes more sense in that it uses (or seems to use) tonal magic in the same way a shout does and tusks the dragons up. I find that a bit easier to swallow than the idea of all dragons not having the sense to realise when they're losing. So I came to terms with the concept of these horns being rare relics of the Akaviri Crusaders, gifted to the khajiit in thanks for their hospitality and perhaps in acknowledgment of the cats' own folklore and mythology - like a common element both cultures share are the dragons.