Forums » General Gaming

How It Should Have Ended

    • 142 posts
    October 19, 2018 1:20 PM EDT

    One of my favorite, favorite Skyrim comics, posted by Owen Parsons for Dorkly, back in 2011, gave me an idea for a discussion. Over the past months, I've read about some of y'all's dissatisfaction with some of the Skyrim questlines, and ones for ESO and DragonAge. I don't play those games, but I can imagine the strictures of gaming, the narrowness of questlines, NPC's lack of dimension...all of these things could be improved. I mean, that's why we have fanfiction and fanart in the first place, right? To put our own spin on it, our own interpretation. And sometimes, just bitch about what could have been. Or SHOULD have been.

     

    I only play Skyrim and Oblivion, so my pick for the most WTF-worthy snub is the Thalmor's dossier on Ulfric Stormcloak. We all know the Dragonborn finds it in Elenwen's torture chamber, but this amazing insight into what makes Ulfric who he is is never used again. It's insane. One of my first fics dealt with this, one I didn't publish here on the Vault, but it's one of my favorite story arcs. 

    Ulfric is a strong Nord, and we can imagine him in the Great War embodying the things Nords prize the most - loyalty, honor, strength, and this larger than life idea that Nords are unbreakable. But then, he's broken. And made to believe the fall of the Imperial City is his fault. His. And maybe he learns this isn't true later on, maybe he doesn't, but how does a Nord like him - one raised on pride and honor - deal with something like this? Is he not unbreakable? Is he not Sovngarde material after all? No, he MUST be. So I imagine that he started to deflect: Skyrim stood for the Imperials, for the Empire, yet no one came for me, for mine. Nords died for the Empire, yet no one stood for us against the Thalmor, when the Thalmor took what was ours. 

    And later - witchmen of the Reach took one of our cities, killed our people, and no one, not the Emperor or the High King, lifted a finger in vengeance. 

    Pride, so much pride. He was broken, and told Elenwen everything he knew, and whether or not that had anything to do with the fall of the Imperial City is neither here nor there. It happened, and it threatened who Ulfric was, his identity as a Nord and his definition of a man. He can't apologize for breaking, because that would be admitting weakness. Can't have that. 

    In the Dossier, it's mentioned that direct contact was made and he "proved his worth as an asset." I do not interpret that as Ulfric willingly helping the Thalmor, but that Ulfric was manipulated once again by them, possibly by Elenwen herself. Manipulated into instigating the Markarth Incident as a way to further destabilize Skyrim. For my fic, I tried to imagine what could break someone like Ulfric - someone disciplined enough to train with the Greybeards and use the voice, a Nord who's been raised on the promise of Sovngarde - and it was devastating to even think about. But break, he did. And that kind of break doesn't heal cleanly, or quickly, and for a skilled "interrogator," there's always a way back into a broken mind, a broken spirit. 

    So here we have Ulfric, feeling underlying guilt because of his role in the Great War, the idea that he was responsible for the deaths of his countrymen - even if he was not. But how easily can his mind, his broken mind, separate what's real and what's fiction these days? Is he a hero responsible for driving the witchmen from Markarth? Or is he a broken weakling responsible for the fall of the Imperial City? Those two ideas have been warring inside him for almost three decades, along with his growing hatred for the Empire who did nothing to help him during the Great War, who trampled over Skyrim's very identity after it, and who failed to recognize him for his efforts in regaining Markarth. 

    Enter the Dossier - what would happen if the Dragonborn had shown Ufric that Dossier? There's lots of scenarios imaginable - death for the insult to his pride. Maybe. Complete denial, ending with the Dossier on the firepit and the Dragonborn locked into a fight to the death. Possibly. 

    I like to think that this would be the final insult. He was manipulated during the Great War. Manipulated after it, manipulated into drawing his countrymen, already weak after fighting in the Great War, into yet another conflict that took them from their homes and families. This is Ulfric, after all. Someone like Galmar might not react the same way - he'd probably just grunt and say something about lying elves, and go on with his war. 

    But Ulfric has been broken - mentally, physically, spiritually. I say giving Ulfric the information contained in the Dossier would have one of two results: one, it would break him completely, and he'd not be able to go on. Every shred of pride and honor and strength he possessed, shattered. I'm married to a soldier, an extremely strong and honorable man, and I can tell you if he went through what Ulfric went through...well. Anyone who experiences war and loss doesn't come back the same. Not to say you can't live your life again, but there's always something broken inside, just waiting for that one last stroke of pressure, one last turn of the screw, and everything shatters. I tell you from experience, wondering about it is terrifying. What Ufric went through...

    Anyway, the second result is the one I'd like to have seen in game, and the one I wrote in my fic: Ulfric goes fucking berserk. In his own mind, he has no honor left - he's been responsible for too much pain in Skyrim. He's been manipulated by the Thalmor one too many times. He's weak, he's nothing. He's not a warrior, not even a man. Sovngarde won't let him in. Unless there's something he can do, something big and bold, something that will absolutely end with his death in glorious battle against the ones who broke him - and broke Skyrim - in the first place. 

    The Thalmor. 

    So, he talks to the Dragonborn, finds out about the Embassy, Elenwen's solar, the secret entrance through the cave. And he takes a cadre of Stormcloaks, and the Dragonborn too, if willing, and he fucking ends it. Annihilates it, every Thalmor, including - especially - Elenwen. And the scene where he finally kills Elenwen would be so much more moving than any of the ones in the Civil War questline where either he or Tullius is just sitting and waiting to die. So much history there, so much emotion, so much passion. And it ends with Ulfric's death, because honestly, he's already dead. He's done. He can't live with himself anymore; there's just enough of himself left to strike this last blow. 

    And, there ends Ulfric, and the Civil War, because I don't believe anyone else could hold the rebellion together. Not yet, anyway. But we have Ulfric as a martyr now, and that's going to come back eventually, of course. Which will be a better foundation for the eventual second Great War, which everyone knows is coming, anyway. And we'd be left to wonder what Empire would do, and the Jarls? What would the Thalmor would do in retaliation, especially with the Emperor dead at the hands of the Dark Brotherhood. Would they strike immediately, or wait? Would they tighten their stranglehold on Skyrim, or relax and give them a sense of false security before the final invasion? 

    Anyway, that's what I'd like to have seen. 

    So, what say you? What are some questlines or just general moments from some of your favorite games you think got the shaft? What could the writers and developers have made amazing and deep if they'd just utilized some mechanic or some woefully underused object or power? 


    This post was edited by ilanisilver at October 19, 2018 1:51 PM EDT
    • 1540 posts
    October 19, 2018 4:24 PM EDT

    Nice idea, Ilani, and started with a thought-provoking subject you've given a lot of thought to. If that came to pass and Ulfric brought the fight to the Thalmor in Skyrim, I'm not convinced the Dominion would be able to retaliate. Like, I think a lot of it is smoke and mirrors in terms of how powerful they are, an illusion we buy into - especially with the Redguards still fighting on. So Sumerset presumably has Dominion boots on the ground in Hammerfell, they have Thalmor agents in Skyrim and the Imperial City, and the TES V MQ hints that there are potentially resistance movements in Valenwood... For a small, island nation they are stretched very thin and still recovering after the Great War. I reckon if the Aldmeri Dominion were in a position to invade anywhere, it would have happened. We may see it as them having a stranglehold on Skyrim, but really they can't police it effectively and are only marginally protected by Imperial law.

    On a related note to Ulfric, one of the things I'd like to have seen expanded upon is the relationship between Ulfric and Balgruuf. Mr The Greater talks about taking the pilgrimage up the 7k Steps to Jurgen's old pad, and I sort of get the feeling there may have been this friendly rivalry between Balgruuf and Ulfric. There's like this subtext going on that never really gets explained, but I imagine Balgrruf taking the pilgrimage in a desire to study with the Greybeards like Ulfric did, but I'm unsure why. Was he inspired by Ulfric? Wanted to prove himself? Or did he have the idea first which Ulfric kinda stole? It's a small thing, but one that still interests me.

    Also, Delphine. How it should have ended is by much more Blades content and Delphine being recognised as one of the best NPCs in the game.

    • 393 posts
    October 19, 2018 4:47 PM EDT

    Oh, this is so cool, Ilani. This is beautiful and I'm loving this despite all the Nord-praising xp I could say a lot about this. I have an entire story about something like this and everything in me itches to speak about this. But I won't. I don't want another debate about why Nords are sweeties and Altmer are evil, which seems to begin every time I say something. I just wanted to let you know that I think that the picture you created here is beautiful, even if I don't exactly agree, just in case it means something for you.

    • 142 posts
    October 19, 2018 4:50 PM EDT

    YES. Delphine and the Blades. She’s such a PITA in the game, but could have been so much more. Last grandmaster, probably. Almost her entire family gone, their purpose forgotten. Remembering characters like Baurus from Oblivion, too, and how great they were makes it doubly bad the Blades just sort of end with them puttering around, all bitter because you won’t kill Paarthurnax. Or at least, I won’t. 

    In my fic, Delphine’s the one who gives the Dossier to Ulfric in the first place. I feel like Bethesda approached their DLC content the way I approach new fics. “But...you haven’t finished this one yet. The Blades, man, there’s so much we can do. Dragons are still around, so the Blades should do more. And the whole Dark Brotherhood wasn’t killed off. What about that? And-“ 

    “No, shhh...vampires. I woke up at 2am thinking about vampires. And also, what if Delvin Mallory had a brother?”

    And yes, Balgruuf. I’m always in favor of more Balgruuf. I feel like I’m making this all about me, and I promise I’m cringing inside, but seriously, I posted like 5 chapters of a fic where Balgruuf and Ulfric met at High Hrothgar as boys, and I really want to keep writing that one, because you’re right, there’s so much history there. 

    I’ll take your word for the condition of Summerset and the Dominion. It’s not my favorite subject matter, so I don’t like to research it. I tend to lean on the efforts of others in that vein. But yes, that’s good news. I can’t wait to see what turns out to be canon in 6. 

     

     

    • 142 posts
    October 19, 2018 4:57 PM EDT

    @Thorien, thanks! No matter if you agree with me or not, it’s always nice to hear that I wrote something you can appreciate, for whatever reason. And if you don’t want to post the story, I’d like to see it if you wouldn’t mind PM-ing it. 

    For the record, it’s not all about Nord praising, although, I can imagine if we wanted to introduce a topic that was basically a virtual war between Nords and Thalmor, that would be really well received! I mentioned my soldier husband, and he’s really big on honor. And I guess we all should be, right? But I think the Nords take it too far. And I don’t really *like* their concept of Sovngarde. Judging your entire life by how gloriously you die isn’t all that for me. But my husband and I have argued a lot about honor, and what it means. To take it to a different fandom for comparison, my husband is basically Captain America. And I’m probably the Hulk. Or possibly Black Widow. Maybe a little bit Tony Stark. So discussions about that sort of thing can be fun. But yeah, I am definitely giving Ulfric more depth here, but to me, his overwhelming senses of honor and pride verge on character flaws rather than strengths. 

    • 393 posts
    October 19, 2018 5:33 PM EDT

    It's mostly in Russian and is as long as Straag Rod (and not finished) but I wouldn't mind to make a synopsis for you if you want. The thing is that I have gonke through all this, Ulfric, Elenwen, Delphine the backstories of them all and other such tnings. I just love psychology and can't help it, I've tried to peek into the heads of them all, it's just a thing I love doing. And I even dare to say that not only soldiers have honor and there can be more than one interpretation of it. Really, I could discuss this stuff forever.

    But I can gotally see this virtual war, it would be like it has been before, me against a crowd of Nord-fans and citing Kirkbride's forum posts like the words of a god. It was fun the first few times, but I'm a bit tired of that already. Don't want to prove anything to anyone.

    Captain America has always been my favorite fellow, even though I think he's a bit naive))


    This post was edited by Justiciar Thorien at October 19, 2018 5:34 PM EDT
    • 1390 posts
    October 19, 2018 6:00 PM EDT

    Frankly, I would have liked to see more done with Magnus and the like in the College of Winterhold, like maybe have more of a grand arcane duel with a boosted Ancano, as each of you vies for control of the Orb. Hell, maybe you could go evil and decide to usurp Ancano

    • 142 posts
    October 19, 2018 6:41 PM EDT
    @Thorien, yes, if you ever get a few minutes to write a synopsis, send it on!!

    @Chris, yes. So much unfinished with Winterhold. Ancano was underutilized as was the Augur of Dunlain.
    • 1390 posts
    October 19, 2018 6:44 PM EDT

    ilanisilver said: @Thorien, yes, if you ever get a few minutes to write a synopsis, send it on!! @Chris, yes. So much unfinished with Winterhold. Ancano was underutilized as was the Augur of Dunlain.

    Its weird that none of the continuation mods don't add on those two, or add an evil end

    • 393 posts
    October 19, 2018 7:10 PM EDT

    ilanisilver said: @Thorien, yes, if you ever get a few minutes to write a synopsis, send it on!!

    I'll translate the beginning for you (which is also an opportunity to edit one more time))) and then let's see if you want more))

    • 142 posts
    October 19, 2018 7:22 PM EDT

    Justiciar Thorien said:

    ilanisilver said: @Thorien, yes, if you ever get a few minutes to write a synopsis, send it on!!

    I'll translate the beginning for you (which is also an opportunity to edit one more time))) and then let's see if you want more))

    Thanks!  Looking forward to it. 

    • 165 posts
    October 19, 2018 7:38 PM EDT

    Cool topic here Ilani. OK, let me confess my personal opinion is that 90% of the major questlines in Skyrim are very bad (I 'm being polite here) compared to Oblivion which is the only other ES game I 've played. As far as a gamer who has played let's just say a lot of games (no life nerd since I was 10 years old :D) in general playing through them I would still say they kinda suck no depth and most of them rushed minus the DB which is slightly better than the rest.

    In regards to Ulfric well, what can I say, I 'm an Ulfric hater. :D

    Note: what I say below is only of what we see in canon lore / Skyrim and not what might be the case etc.

    The moment I realized the situation of the lore Empire vs Aldmeri etc Ulfric fell to the lowest pits of Oblivion as a character for me. Putting aside for a moment what he went through the guy has way below zero ability to be in a political position or to lead anything. I mentioned this yesterday as well but the guy is the most dangerous person for Skyrim and maybe the Empire. Just the fact that he can't recognize Skyrim's and the Empire's position and just goes to make a civil war in such a situation is monumentally stupid and he has non existant, to put it politely ability as a leader and politician. In terms of how bad his move is to start this civil war it is on a scale that the exact next move above that is to go and fight for the Thalmor against Skyrim and the Empire directly, this move was just that bad politically and in many other levels from what we see in the situation up to the events of Skyrim.

    Side note: Rather than fighting a civil war how about building a god damn school and advance as a society beyond the activities of drinking mead, talking about Sovngarde and swinging weapons or fists.

    Regarding his character we could make many interpretations. Mine is that he is just angry and a mix of a few other things but mostly it should be anger and hatred that drives him against the Thalmor (that is why he is so dangerous to lead anyone) and only after that anger comes the whole deal of Skyrim for the Nords, no ban on Talos worship etc. I would prefer Cicero by far to lead compared to Ulfric at least he would kill the right people he was told to.

    Also don't forget that in ES there is Illusion magic so I can not imagine many who wouldn't break in the hands of the Thalmor and that breaking is the reason for what I said above and why he should be removed and that would be where the dossier comes in to spice things up and have some sort of reaction maybe him waking up and realize what he was doing or diving deeper into madness.

    Moving on I totally agree many things with the questlines should have been done much better than what we get. The blades, the dossier, Ulfric, civil war, CoW, Companions... I will bitch mostly about CoW since I 'm more of a mage myself

    STOP RIGHT THERE CRIMINAL SCUM, YOU VIOLATED MY QUESTLINES!

    Now, let me do my casual bitching on the College of Winterhold questline. My Altmer Mystic can only call this endeavor as degrading and an insult to all mages, if he could he would soul trap this damn questline and keep it locked away forever. This was the most dissapointing questline I 've ever went through in any game I played up until now mostly because this is damn ES and you expect shit to go down. It looked so rushed with zero depth and so short. It was like someone wrote it during WC recreational time or something. Really it was so damn rushed with a random villain who was a Thalmor because yeah he wears fancy black clothes and people should think Thalmor are bad so let's make two of them villains for a questline... They had such great subjects as the Eye of Magnus and Psijics and they did nothing with them, nothing... Rather than having the averaje Thalmor to act as villain why not improvise and have some other power like a deadric prince or some cult or even some surviving snow elf acting as villain but they had to put such a generic with no depth at all villain like Ancano... Psijics why utilize them so little and why not have some continuation with the Psijics advising and giving you some more quests regarding the eye and its power or history and also why not have better teachers inside the college and a better AI with lessons etc. I don't think I should go on because there are so many things wrong here...

    I won't go deeper but yeah this CoW questline was the worst thing I 've seen in a very long time because this is the mage questline in damn ES game you would expect something more. Maybe they expected someone to mod it later on and expand it or something which I wish someone would take on to make such a mod because I never felt that I had something as a main mage questline in Skyrim whenever I played as a mage and most of my mage playthroughs never finished the questline I was just joining to roleplay as a member of the CoW and sometimes I didn't even bother and had other ways to acquire spell tomes. Let's just hope we will get some decent questlines for ES 6.

    There is also the damn Companions, do you people even keep track how fast you go up the ranks? The same thing happens here as in CoW questline and it might be more severe but I am not a pure fighter type so did Companions only like two times and didn't bother with it again, boring questline and it makes no sense at all the way you progress through it. The whole deal with the Silver Hand was so lame and felt like a filler quest while expecting the main thing that never came...

    OK, bitching is over, nothing to see here. Move along now. :D

    @Thorien - I wouldn't be that much against the Thalmor. To be honest I just don't like the way Bethesda tried to portray them in game and how they handle some things other than that well, Elven supremacy is the only truth! kidding :P

    Note: Sorry for long post! Also sorry for any typos lack of sleep has hit me hard!


    This post was edited by Duvain at October 19, 2018 7:52 PM EDT
    • 142 posts
    October 19, 2018 8:17 PM EDT
    @Duvain, I’m not an Ulfric supporter either- I played the Stormcloak side for the first time a few months ago and felt like I needed a shower. I just wish they’d gotten a little deeper into the character and the situation as a whole, rather than make the Civil War so formulaic.

    And yeah, I agree that the Companions line was not well thought out. It’s my favorite just because it’s the Companions and I LOVE them, but it could have been better. I would have loved an option where you tell Skjor no, for example. With another line of quests you complete without the beastblood. And maybe you take it later because things are more urgent. But the ultimatum was lame.
    • 67 posts
    October 20, 2018 12:36 AM EDT

    I actually dont really like any of the Big Questline. You are ALWAYS the Unique Chosen One. Main Quest: OH youre the LEGENDARY Dragonborn uuuhhhh youre so Awesome. DB: OH youre the Listener uuuuhhhhh CoW : You get Chosen by the Psijics and become Archmage after like 6 easy quests. Thieves Guild: You become a super Thief as a Nightingale because you are Special. Just comes off as Forced Power Fantasy. I dont want to be Forced to be a Werewolf or forced as a Apprentice Mage to become Archmage 

    I miss Oblivion where you were just a Dude. no Chosen one Nothing just a Regular ol Dude.


    This post was edited by Vezrabuto at October 20, 2018 12:39 AM EDT
    • 142 posts
    October 20, 2018 1:15 AM EDT

    @Vezrabuto, yeah, I agree somewhat. I roll my eyes every time the Psijic guy says “we believe in you.” Really? Why? I’m just some dumbass who joined the CoW so I could get access to the Magical College of Winterhold mod with the practice golem in the Hall of Elements. But, ok. And I’m ”the special” because of Kodlak’s dream, and forcing me to become a werewolf to continue the questline is annoying. 

    But in Oblivion, didn’t Uriel Septim have the same sort of dream Kodlak did? I thought he did, that he dreamed about the Champion of Cyrodiil before we showed up in the prison. But yeah. Oblivion’s questlines were superior, I thought. 

    • 67 posts
    October 20, 2018 3:57 AM EDT

    dont remember much about the Main Quest. but im pretty sure the tutorial is the only time that happens. and then again you are just handed the Amulet and told to see Joffrey not that you are a super powerfull Ancient Legend with Dragonblood in you. Youre a Dude who the Emperor dreamed off :D 

    In Oblivion you had to Do 7! Quests that Test youre Magic abilities before you even start the actual Mages Guild. in Skyrim hmmmmm do a Firebolt ....... k youre in :D And then you get 11! Main Guild quests. Skyrim gives you what 6 - 7 Missions? And i LOVED the Rank System in the Guilds where you actually feel like youre rising up the Ranks :D

    • 165 posts
    October 20, 2018 6:22 AM EDT

    Yeah most of the the questlines leave many things to be desired. By the way I 've only completed the civil war twice once with Imperials and once with Stormclaoks and I also needed a bath after that. :P Skyrim's questlines are not even a selling point of the game they are there to tie it up a bit and because they should exist anyway. The main selling point of the game is the world and the roleplay you can do in it or just straight up go free roam and kill whatever comes your way or just put survival mods and try to survive in the wilderness or something liek that. I only wish that for ES 6 they will put some more thought into the questlines, the writing done on the current ones we have in Skyrim is just horrible and a turn off for any roleplay you have to think a ton of ways to prevent advancement and delay them I mean come on, really...?

    By the way there is a mod called Enhanced Skyrim Factions: The Companions I think it will let you tweak the questline to make it longer in terms of how you advance and also require skill levels at a certain number and you can reject the beast blood and not become werewolf and best of all it is all customizable from MCM not sure if there is for SE I don't play on SE.

    @Vezrabuto - That is why most of my mages just join CoW and not do the questline. Skyrim's thieve's guild questline cannot even compare with Oblivion's they are worlds apart but in regards to just roleplay I found that those little missions you get from Vex and Delvin can set you up for some good traveling around Skyrim if you don't use fast travel which is the only redeeming feature it has for me in regards to roleplay and in regards to writing and excitement to advance through it well, it lacks severely compared to Oblivion.

    Sadly the good times of Oblivion questlines is gone in Skyrim that is why I have just started moding Oblivion again to play some cool questlines. Free roam in Skyrim is good and all but you can't just have an open world experiense all the time if I wanted that I would go to play some mmorpg not an rpg.

    There is also another cool thing in Oblivion, the "racial element" is not as bad as it is in Skyrim with the whole men vs elves, Skyrim is for the Nords, Magic is Bad and for the weak lol and a main questline full of "Nord thing". When I did the main quest for the first time and went with my Altmer mage in Sovngarde I was like, "Should I really be here? Maybe I should come back another time." And I still have a slight tingling when I do the main questline with characters like Orcs or w/e but then again I might be the weird one here. :P

    Let's just put our hopes on ES 6.

    • 393 posts
    October 20, 2018 6:31 AM EDT

    There's a very cool mod I found recently, allows you to bathe in Skyrim. With soap. I think my character will take a very long bath and use a lot of soap after Sovngarde. I can't help but think of it as a prison. A prison where you go after you are freed from another prison, isn't that hilarious? And the possibility that after death you'll end up there again makes me even more sick than all Daedra and Talos together.

    And note, I haven't even metioned Thalmor once)))

    • 265 posts
    October 20, 2018 1:14 PM EDT

    Vezrabuto said:

    I miss Oblivion where you were just a Dude. no Chosen one Nothing just a Regular ol Dude.

    This is not entirely correct. You aren't just some random dude who was fortunately placed in a cell that the Emperor would that day escape through, you were written within the Elder Scrolls and dreamed of personally by the Emperor himself. For all intents and purposes, you were destined to stop the Oblivion Crisis. Then you need to remember you're not some mortal either: you're Shezzarrine; a fragment of Lorkhan like Pelinal Whitestrake, Talos, Wulfharth, and others before you.


    This post was edited by Ebonslayer at October 20, 2018 1:16 PM EDT
    • 165 posts
    October 20, 2018 1:35 PM EDT

    @Ebonslayer - I don't think the CoC was anything in the beginning he was just an average prisoner dude also there is no mention of him being a Shezzarrine not in the beginning at last later on he mantles and goes bonkers but he started as the average dude. Every MC in ES games is always the "chosen person" it's just that the feeling you get at Oblivion's questlines is toned down by a whole lot compared to Skyrim's and you don't just do 5-8 quests in order to own the whole thing... :P

    On another note that is why we have alternate start mods :D


    This post was edited by Duvain at October 20, 2018 1:36 PM EDT
    • 142 posts
    October 20, 2018 2:42 PM EDT

    @Thorien, I have the modded house Waterview, and it has a shower. If you make soap and washcloths for it, you can bathe in the shower and get a "clean" bonus. A couple of times I sort of shoved Vilkas in there, just for fun. It doesn't work for followers, though. 

    And that's another thing that sort of annoys me about Skyrim. When I started writing fic, I looked into some of the Scandinavian societies the Nords were based on, and the whole dirty, unwashed barbarian thing seems to be unfounded, historically speaking. Barbarians, definitely, but Vikings were pretty meticulous about grooming, and their warriors made frequent use of hot springs and combs. So the Companions being constantly dirty, I mean, yeah, they wouldn't be constantly clean, but I don't think they'd have walked around with greasy hair and dirty faces 24/7. Definitely on raids, when bathing isn't quite so easy, but not at home. 

    @Duvain, yeah, I agree. The questlines aren't why I still play Skyrim after all this time. It's the immersion, and the feeling that I'm escaping into a fantasy. But I imagine if they combined the depth of Oblivion with the beauty and limitlessness of Skyrim, yeah. I'd probably never leave the house. :)

     

    • 393 posts
    October 20, 2018 2:58 PM EDT

    I meant it in the spiritual/emotional way rather than literal. The feeling as if you have been soiled and there's never enough soap to wash it away.

    Vikings may be not so dirty but Nords aren't exactly Vikings.


    This post was edited by Justiciar Thorien at October 20, 2018 2:59 PM EDT
    • 56 posts
    October 31, 2018 1:02 AM EDT

    This is great. It reminds of this video I watched a few years back. You've likely seen it before, but is hilarious no matter how many times you watch it :D

    Skyrim - How it Should Have Ended


    This post was edited by Furrion 17 at October 31, 2018 1:03 AM EDT
    • 142 posts
    October 31, 2018 2:21 AM EDT
    @Furrion, believe it or or I had not seen that video. I was hoping it would be something like the DB riding on Odahviing like Bastian rides on Falkor at the end of he Neverending Story. I mean, that’s what I’d do with a dragon. Fly around and knock all my enemies into dumpsters.