Forums » Elder Scrolls

Lycanthropy vs Vampirism

  • February 27, 2015 10:06 PM EST

    This was definitely made before, but I was just wondering on your guys opinion. 

    Does the unrelenting, brute force of a Werewolf make you powerful?

    Or does the taste of flesh and blood make your tastes sated?

    • 87 posts
    February 27, 2015 10:21 PM EST

    In terms of power, vampirism is much more powerful when Dawnguard is added. In fact, it isn't even close - Vampire Lord gives you more powerful abilities than lycanthropy, allows you to transform back and forth multiple times a day at will, and gives you no noticeable drawbacks. The sunlight penalties are barely a problem to any powerful character, as they only slow your stat regeneration and lower your stats (which the Vampire Lord form promptly negates). Vampirism doesn't remove your sleeping benefits, and you also don't lose your damn clothes all the time.

    This being said, I like lycanthropy more.

    • 189 posts
    February 27, 2015 10:48 PM EST

    Eh, I think the vampirism stunted attributes and regen are much for of an annoyance than anything brought on by becoming a werewolf. Losing your clothes and losing access to Rested are both way less significant sacrifices to me. Heck, I'm happy to take those hits purely for the disease immunity, even if I never bother to change form. Werewolves can transform more than once per day as well, simply by acquiring the Ring of Hircine ... Which is easy to obtain at any level.

    I disagree -- I think it is close. Closer than most people seem to think. Werewolves are superior physical fighters, vampire lords are superior magical fighters. I also prefer lycanthropy because it's more streamlined (no need to constantly switch spells/powers) and because the Stamina buffs are really helpful for exploration. Plus I find the physical style of fighting to be more enjoyable. And personally, I actually do find the vampirism sun stunting to be pretty cumbersome to deal with in general.

    I really only play vampires for Necromage, or for a dark mage who is well suited to take advantage of the Ring of the Erudite + VL form. The Sneak/Illusion benefits and basically all other powers and abilities provided by vampirism are generally superfluous in my experience.

    • 249 posts
    February 28, 2015 4:08 AM EST
    I'm biased because my favorite mythical creature is a werewolf but I've played so much more as a vampire. Vampirism has so many different angles: Necromage combos, Illusion and Sneak bonuses, four Greater Powers, Vampire Lord spells and abilities; not to mention the fact that all of this can be used in addition to all your regular abilities.

    Werewolves are awesome for the first few times but the playstyle becomes bland. The howls are awesome but you only get one at a time. It basically becomes a game of batting mice around, mauling them, howling, and repeat. IF werewolves had access to all their howls through a menu and had a sneak option, that would have been it for me. Werewolves in fiction have always been pretty vicious but they have also been able to stalk their prey as the ultimate predator of night. I know Morrowind's werewolf form allowed sneak attacks and it felt right. Lorewise, Skyrim's werewolves are supposed to be more vicious but I miss the optional stalker playstyle.

    All this being said, my latest vampire playthrough has been my favorite to date and the build really complements it so I'm going with vampire :)
    • 1 posts
    February 28, 2015 4:45 AM EST

    I don't like Vampirism because I hate playing at night and It's really annoying when you exit anything indoors at daytime

    • 249 posts
    February 28, 2015 4:50 AM EST
    "Sun Damage" is only annoying to warrior types in my experience.
    • 168 posts
    February 28, 2015 1:23 PM EST

    It all depends on your play style. If you love melee combat, be a werewolf. If you love magic, be a vampire lord.

    • 87 posts
    February 28, 2015 9:11 PM EST

    First of all, Vampire Lords do 24 unarmed damage for the Werewolves' 20. Werewolves are not more powerful physical fighters.

    Also, your base stat increases in Vampire Lord form are higher than a werewolf's. Your stat regeneration stunt is balanced by the fact that you get an almost free spell that absorbs health/magicka/stamina from a large area. You do much more melee damage when you factor in Night Cloak and Poison Talons (let alone the Ring of the Beast). You move just as quickly as a werewolf, but you also walk on water. You resist more than half of frost damage, have bonuses to sneaking and illusion, and are completely immune to both disease and poison. You don't need to kill people to remain in God Mode Vampire Lord form. You can resurrect powerful bodies at will, throw people from cliffs for 50 magicka, summon two gargoyles, see in the dark, teleport short distances, and more. The only disadvantage is that there is a single menu to navigate through if you want to use all of your powers.

    Vampire Lord form is God Mode, which is why I don't enjoy it.

    • 253 posts
    February 28, 2015 9:17 PM EST

    Not to mention that Vampire Lords, while grounded, can use Advanced Unarmed Combat exceptionally well by using a quick vampiric grip followed up by supernatural reflexes. No werewolf could ever match that level of physical combat.

    • 87 posts
    February 28, 2015 9:28 PM EST

    I do want to stress that Vampire Lords are the "best" choice for both melee fighters and mages. They do 24 damage to the Werewolves' 20. If you add in Poison Claws, they do 44. If you add in Ring of the Beast on top of that, they do 64. If you add in Night Cloak, they also have constant effect damage on foes.

    Vampires can do up to 64 damage per strike. Werewolves can do a flat 20. However, a Khajiit with maximized unarmed enchantments (no exploits), Daedric Gauntlets, and that Heavy Armor perk can do up to 82 damage with each strike. Though vampirism is a better choice here than lycanthropy, Khajiits still win.

    You are right, Teccam, and thanks for correcting me. A werewolf's claw attack damage increases with level and a vampire's does not. I still hold my position in that vampires are more powerful in general, though the werewolf is better at melee.

    • 189 posts
    February 28, 2015 9:37 PM EST

    Where are you getting your numbers? By my estimation, a werewolf at level 50+ with all the appropriate perks and the Ring of Bloodlust will do 240 damage per attack, not 20 ... And werewolf directional power attacks ragdoll everything other than dragons and mammoths (which are staggered).

    If VL claws have a base damage of 24 -- I've never checked for myself but I'll assume you're correct -- then a Vampire Lord at 50+ with the appropriate perks and Ring of the Beast should do 104 damage per attack. And IIRC, Vampire Lord directional power attacks do not ragdoll or stagger. I haven't played a melee VL in ages but I'm fairly certain that's the case.

    Also, at 50+, werewolves get 400 passive AR vs. 300 for Vampire Lords. I stand by werewolves being the superior melee fighters.

    • 180 posts
    February 28, 2015 9:39 PM EST

    Werewolf damage increases by level. http://www.gamefaqs.com/xbox360/615803-the-elder-scrolls-v-skyrim/answers/307016-how-is-werewolf-damage-calculated-is-there-a-way-to-increase

    By about level 45 a werewolf can do 80 unarmed damage. Take the bestial strength perks to max and that becomes 160. 

    • 161 posts
    February 28, 2015 10:12 PM EST

    I like werewolves But I think in Skyrim they didnt show the true strength of a Vampire. Their not some Sexual blood-suckers, The have supernatural Speed and Night powers also strength passed a Werewolf in Human form but they did the same to a Werewolf were almost every sense in enhanced. 

    • 189 posts
    February 28, 2015 10:30 PM EST

    I have a few tricks up my sleeve as well, Ben. Between two old tricksters ... Does yours only work for werewolves, and not vampire lords?

    • 30 posts
    February 28, 2015 11:06 PM EST

    Actually, it really depends on the kind of build you're going for. From a magic perspective, i can say that both sub races synergize well the spells in the alteration and destruction school, sometimes werewolf more than vampire for the spells in ranged touch mode (ie: Cloak Spells, Flesh spells, Candlelight, etc)

    That said, whilst i am currently exploring the werewolf sub race, I can safely say that vampires get the most kick out of it due to the necromage / vampirism combo. 

    Werewolves, not so much, but they do have their applications in combat.

    • 237 posts
    March 1, 2015 4:05 AM EST

    I've gotta go with Team Jacob.  Those muscles!

    Oh, wait.  We were talking about... oh, I see.

    In the long run, I prefer vampires for most of my characters just because of Necromage.  Werewolves can be really scary with the right build, though!  There's something to be said for ragdolling giants.

  • March 1, 2015 6:18 AM EST

    I prefer Lycanthropy over Vampirism myself, but after Dawnguard I have been a Vampire Lord more often.

    • 1483 posts
    March 1, 2015 9:46 AM EST

    Oh Ben... I envy you 

    • 237 posts
    March 1, 2015 1:57 PM EST

    He was the hero of that one mobile game... even got to use an assault rifle.  I always edited the ME2 ini files to give him back his rifle.  Kept him relevant for a few more missions, at least.

    • 743 posts
    March 1, 2015 10:06 PM EST

    If it was Oblivion that comment would be false. You'd literally die within 15 seconds if you were a vampire in the sun.

    • 95 posts
    March 2, 2015 9:25 AM EST

    Untrue, I have a level 36 and I have so far lasted over 30 minuets. Stage Four I might add... :P

    • 95 posts
    March 2, 2015 10:34 AM EST

    Ok, I am going to go insane here and give an in depth review on my views for Lycanthropy and Vampire Lord.

    Werewolf: Pure brute force melee and the ability to feed while fighting. Have the ability to break the feeding cycle and jump back into the fight. A special ring they have increases their damage by double and an Orc will increase that even further for sixty seconds with Berserk Rage.With all allocated perks and things I have listed: 240*2= 480! Ragdoll included.

    Werewolf Downside: Form must be Maintained instead of switched on and off. Also... You can only have this much power in Werewolf Form! No sneaking for even more damage with unarmed. And also, with the ring that is used for werewolf, you will take more damage once berserk rage ends... That's a "BOO!" in my books...

    Vampire Lord: Necromage affects their ring, giving 22.5 extra damage instead of 20. Berserk Rage as an Orc Necro-vampire combined with (24+25)*2.5= 122.5= 122 Damage per swipe of a claw for 90 seconds. Quick Reflexes will help make this last seemingly longer since it kind of acts like a Slow Time shout and will last longer. Mist Form allows us to vanish and heal while in the night or even the day if you can bypass the health and stamina regen issue. In Human form, you gain this extra 22.5 damage in Human Form, allowing your human form fists to be boosted. These can be boosted in further by an Orc's Berserk Rage, 25*2.5= 62.5. This and a Sneak attack will double the damage further. Night-cloak and Poison talons will aid Vampirism further. Amulet of Bats turns bats into a Shield-charge based move.

    Vampire Lord Downside: Daytime weakness. So an attribute reduction and zero regen during the day. A bit of bad self-promotion here, but my glitch for "Alternative Vampirism" allows me to keep this problem to a minimal (Stage one) and a bit of Fortify Restoration+Lady Stone (I believe gives 25% Health and Stamina Regen) can easily bypass this even further. Feeding with the Ring of Namira will Boost Regen Further.

    MY conclusion.

    Werewolves with all their fortifications may be fast, brutal and outright crazy powerful, but they have one disadvantage. They will take more damage with the Ring of Bloodlust once Berserk Rage ends.Though it's power attacks are brutal, they do have chances of missing and failing.

    Vamirpirism has it's daylight weakness, but one can ultimately bypass those with ease and Necromage aids everything, including the resistances and damage boost of Berserk Rage and the damage boost from it's Ring of the Beast.

    I give it ultimately to Vampirism for a few reasons:

    1) Necromage will enhance the duration of Mist Form and Supernatural Reflexes, giving Vampirism a much needed edge in Melee Combat.

    2)The Shield charge-based "Bats" move will instantly bash a Werewolf down and can be used twice before cooldown, allowing one to constantly assault the Werewolf until it dies.

    3) Night Cloak will provide extra damage against a Werewolf every second as well, making any health regen a Werewolf is allowed almost useless.

    4) MY final reason is that, if one exits Vampire Lord form and one uses Slow Time when boosted with Necromage and Stability, Shadow Warrior will last more than 5 seconds and allow you to perform a sneak attack when combined with the Ring of the Beast, Necromage and Berserk Rage, ultimately avoiding a Werewolf Deathblow and giving it a death-strike of your own. Maybe give the Werewolf a German Suplex XD (WWE Reference intended.)

    • 95 posts
    March 2, 2015 11:52 AM EST

    I just remembered three more reason!

    5) If you can do the Companion Equip glitch so you can equip items in Vampire Lord form, a Vampire Lord Form can utilize up to THREE Cloaks (The third lasting for a limited time). Ebony Mail + Night Cloak + Fire/Frost/Lightning/Whirlwind Cloak.

    6) A Vampire Lord with Necromage gains even more power from the shout Dragon Aspect and it lasts longer. Dragon Aspect + Berserk Rage + Necromage + Vampire Lord relevant perks when all utilized with a single power attack will absolutely devastate most enemies.

    7) Dragon Aspect and Ebony Flesh stack, granting a total of 250 armor bonus for Vampire Lord form with Necromage, where-as Werewolves only get 200. Sure a Werewolf gets 600 Armor and a Vampire Lord gets 550, but the weakened state due to the Ring of Bloodlust for Werewolves makes this a NO-contest boost to Vampires. I did not incorperate the Mage Armor perks for this, since I do not know if they apply, but if they do, a werewolf gets 400 bonus, making 800 armor total. A Necro-Vampire lord gains 125+375= 500, granting them a total of 800. Making this a deadlock for armor rating. But the only difference is that it will last longer for a Vampire Lord.

    So... I say Vampires for me due too the higher versatility...

    • 88 posts
    March 25, 2015 3:11 PM EDT

    Man I wanna play a werewolf now ...

    • 189 posts
    March 25, 2015 3:24 PM EDT

    This thread gave me the itch too, when it was first posted. My next build is gonna be all over dat beast form! I watched Gopher's two Skyrim Mod Sanctuary videos for werewolves last week and I'm getting ready to go!