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A race's justification for joining the Stormcloak or Legion caus

    • 10 posts
    September 4, 2013 1:24 AM EDT

    The topic says all, this topic is one where we can talk about someone from the nine races' justification for joining either the rebellion or to support the Legion. I made this a while back :

    Altmer: We have seen the Thalmor treat our own no better than the Empire during the War. <-> Let the Stormcloaks preach their worship of a genocidal mad man, they are but paper tigers who is better off united so the Empire lies demoralized and broken and we focus on the real threat to a new Merethic Era.

    Argonian: The Nords treatment of us is as cruel as the Dunmer but as the Dunmer do nothing, we will do something. <-> The Argonians should do the patriotic thing and help the Nords run the Dunmer out of the Grey Quarter! We will earn the loyalty of the Nords here before they do.

    Breton: Like any good Breton who remember Ulfric for his actions in Markarth and how he wanted the hold to finish what he had started, joining the Empire and bringing the butcher to justice is only fitting <-> Bretons are part of Skyrim now, and most importantly, drawing a line in the sand as Skyrim's indepedence is a statement that High Rock will not suffer the same fate as Hammerfell. Plus, It was a Breton who wanted to see the Emperor die

    Bosmer: If we support the Imperials here, Valenwood will receive greater aid against the Dominion as they had done so for us <-> Bosmer and the Thalmor are not good friends, to support the Stormcloak to spit at the face of the Thalmor will be ideal option

    Dunmer: The Nords treatment of Dunmer is worse than any other race, we will join the empire and have our vengeance <-> Ulfric only rolled back the welcome mat due to the Dunmer continuing to leech off the benefits of the Former High King who was an utter weakling. By Boethiah we will help Ulfric take Skyrim to prove we are not freeloaders but working to earn our keep, remember Boethiah is a patron of wolves, not lambs. 

    Imperial: Uphold the Empire and the Emperor's will, no matter the cost <-> The Empire is only an Empire in name only, but we remember that Talos was once a Nord and by that we will fight to support the true Emperor, not this false leader who isn't even one of the Septim bloodline!

    Khajit: Discrimination against us by the Nords have proven them unworthy, helping the Empire triumph will allow Skyrim to open up caravans of the Empire to trade with us <-> We make our mark alone in Skyrim, without the Empire's help. Also any move against the Thalmor is considered a move beneficial to the Khajit.

    Nord: Brother against brother? This fighting only shows how divided we are, we must stand as one empire or fall divided <-> Skyrim for the Nords! When the Imperials refuse to accept Ulfric's claim they had betrayed us all

    Orc: The Empire and the Orcs have been amible, no sense to betray them, and Ulfric needs a REAL opponent in battle, not that weakling of a king he had killed. <-> Ulfric earned his right to be king, and the Orcs will support that claim. And Ulfric slaughtered Bretons at Markarth who in had slaughtered our kin at Orsinium, that's enough to like him!

    Redguard: The Nords have bad blood with us longer than we had with you, let us fight in Red and teach them who are the true human warriors of Tamriel! <-> When we lost land to the Thalmor the Empire failed us. We are going to teach the Human puppets of the Empire how we really fight as Stormcloaks

    Also, on the subject of racism, did it felt too subtle? You would had thought there would be active pogroms or hunts for non-Nords but aside from verbal posturing, you don't see real racial tensions flare up even though there were opportunities like Siege of Windhelm where you could rile up the Argonians to purge the Dark Elves in the Grey Quarter, or help the overseer break up a laborer's revolt . Something like Dragon Age so to speak where you could feel the racial tensions between the Elves and humans. 

  • September 4, 2013 1:40 PM EDT

    I'm confused. 

    • 856 posts
    September 4, 2013 3:36 PM EDT

    The OP took each race and gave generic RP reasons for joining either side of the civil war (first Empire; then Stormcloaks).

    @ OP, This discussion may be more suited for the Role-Playing Group.

    • 91 posts
    September 4, 2013 3:51 PM EDT

    These are decent reasons for the races to join a side. The Argonian reasoning of "We'll help the Stormcloaks so that the Dark Elves are hated more then us" is something I've actually considered using myself in a play through.

    I'd say that the Imperial and Altmer reasons for joining the Stormcloaks are the most difficult to justify though. Even if the characters themselves were willing to join I just don't really see Ulfric and co. wanting or accepting them around their military forces. Spies just seem too much of a danger. Just my two cents though.

    • 10 posts
    September 5, 2013 2:28 AM EDT

    An Altmer stormcloak would most likely be an outlander, someone on the run from Thalmor persecution or similar problems. The Imperial Empire is no longer safe for them given the WGC making the Imperial puppets of the Thalmor. Better a land not only backed by a huge buffer of land than being next to the Thalmor and the dominion. Also, while Storm don't need magic, having someone with the knowledge to counter Imperial Mages and Thalmor or perhaps help make the SC weapons more potent will aid them immensely.

    Imperial citizens joining the Stormcloak cause are most likely more faithful to the man who founded the Empire than the Empire he founded. So long as an Imperial proves his faith is to Talos rather than the Empire the Imperial will be almost as welcomed as a fellow Nord. As with the Altmer's understanding of magic, Imperial Citizens know how to effectively disrupt the regular Legion's formations compared to the Nord Legionaires 

    • 127 posts
    September 5, 2013 3:54 AM EDT

    I've used the Altmer stormcloak justification, actually, saying how it's just one step from 'Elves are superior' to 'Altmer are superior' then to 'Thalmor are superior'.  As one gets grounded, systems are put in action to establish the next highest rank and standard for elimination.

    • 10 posts
    December 4, 2013 1:40 AM EST

    For the Thalmor Altmer to fully back it, it is a case of long haul vs short haul. Destroy the legacy of the Butcher or those who directly Butcher the madman that is Tiber Septim.

    Also, a blog detailing the Stormcloak Civil War debate had me thinking about what a Dunmer would consider joining if forced to and I base it on the house they would back

    Redoran are supportive of the Stormcloak since Redoran's pretty much Nord in all but race but the offering of Solstheim may make some consider. With the Hlaalu they would support the empire so they have a place to eventually strike back into Morrowind through Imperial Support. House Dres will also be staunch allies of the Stormcloaks, seeing little love for the Empire and the cold climate is perfect for them to hide in. 

    For Telvanni though there is as many reasons to side with the Stormcloaks as to side with the Imperials. If they cooperate with the Stormcloaks they will be able to use it to put the Argonians and Khajit in their place as they have constantly enslaved them. But the Imperials are at least more tolerant towards magic than the Stormcloaks who have been perscuting the mages at Winterhold

    Indoril if it had existed would support the Stormcloak since it along with Dres sworn to resist the Empire to the Bitter end and an Indoril will squeal in delight in doing damage to the legacy of a crippled empire.

  • December 4, 2013 2:42 PM EST

    Based on my knowledge of the White-Gold Concordant, I feel Redguards would fight with the Stormcloaks. The Empire left Hammerfell on it's own for the Dominion to take. I feel that they would hold more spite for the Dominion and The Empire.

    • 45 posts
    December 5, 2013 4:34 PM EST

    Racism is definitely underwhelming in Skyrim, especially compared to how it was in Morrowind.

    • 36 posts
    December 5, 2013 5:34 PM EST
    Bosmer: and before I start I know I'm gonna get a lot of hate they should join the ....Stormcloaks because the stormcloaks hate thalmor so do a lot of wood elves the high elves invaded valenwood and killed and burned a lot of trees and people if you have met faendal then you probably think they should join the imperials but he's probably brainwashed like a lot of other bosmer, so I rest my case bosmer should join the stormcloaks
  • January 20, 2016 5:49 PM EST

    I guess I will reanimate this thread as it concerns a question I had in the lore section.

    About the bad blood between the Redguards and Nords. The War of Bend'r-mahk (during Jagar Tharn's reign) in which Nords were the aggressors involved Bretons of Jehanna and Redguards of Dragonstar and Elinhir, hardly representative of the Redguard people. Elinhir was reclaimed by the Redguards and Dragonstar's and Jehanna's situations have yet to be clarified as of the fourth era. Redguards and Nords -- on a political scale -- have had little interaction with each other.

    Still, Redguards would likely be sympathetic to the Stormcloaks. A Redguard organization published a Nord's recordings of escaping the Thalmor (Flight from The Thalmor) and as for some cultural meshing, a Redguard wrote fairly about the Nords (Skyrim's Rule). If there was any historical tension between the two, that would have been the opportunity  to mention it. Moreover, a Redguard couple in Markarth -- Endon and Kerah -- discuss their son joining the Stormcloaks.

    A more subtle piece of evidence for Redguard and Stormcloak compatibility lies in a lie; Eydis (a Nord) lies to her son about his father's (Firir) whereabouts [spoiler: he's dead], saying he joined the Stormcloaks in one instance and the Legion in another. The subtly? The child suspected nothing about his father joining the Stormcloaks, and children are very much aware of the basic identity of the Stormcloaks, evident by Ralof's nephew's comments and the orphan's in Windhelm.

    It also is not impossible for a Redguard to agree with the Stormcloak's sentiments about the Empire, as are the words of Sayma: And between you and me? He [Torygg] wasn't even that good a king. All of those rambling speeches about the Empire this, and the Empire that..

    Other plausible reasons for a Redguard to support the Stormcloaks is a Redguard being a Talos worshiper (which would be legal in Hammerfell), being raised in Skyrim, or having a Nord spouse who would be affect the White-Gold Concordant. Basic human reasons that colour many conflicts. Redguards can have self-interests.


    Bretons are not Reachmen and Reachmen are not Bretons, and they would gladly disown each other; moreover, the war crimes attributed to Ulfric are questionable. It was the Imperial aligned jarl who did the executing, as stated by the imprisoned Forwson, not Ulfric.

    The only example of a Breton joining the Stormcloaks is Laelette, which was a lie people believed. Again, good lies are not outrageous; however, High Rock did ignore Ulfric's call for an alliance. Regardless, Bretons could join for the same humans I presented for the Redguards.


    Imperials likely would not join the Stormcloaks, and Arcadia and Adrianne have concerning comments regarding a Stormcloak presence. Still, the same basic reasons apply, and of the Imperials who would join, they would probably be Colovian more often on account of similar cultures; and Tiber Septim's race is debatable, not that him being a Nord would legitimize the Stormcloak's cause. The Nords bent the knee because of his shouting, not because of his race, and an Imperial joining for something as trivial as that should be removed from the gene pool.


    Elves [excluding Orcs] would not join the Stormcloaks. Let me rephrase that: an elf with sense would not join the Stormcloaks. The reasons should be obvious.


    Khajiit are not even allowed in their cities for goodness sake. If someone wants to use their unique, overpowered Dragonborn Khajiit to argue against the narrative of the world, slap yourself. Slap yourself hard and often.


    Nords have a history of bad blood with the Orcs, although it has lessened over the years. They at best tolerate orcish presence, that is until Orcs decide to move on fertile land... and who in the flying flipping f**k would want to mate with Orcs?

    Besides, it is not their fight.


    Argonians... meh.

    • 47 posts
    January 24, 2016 7:57 PM EST
    Love the idea of this thread.

    You probably should note that before the arrow is reason for imperial, after is for storm cloak. And this probably belongs in the role play thread.

    I'm really a big fan of this though. I always struggle to think of legit reasons for races to join one side over the other.
    • 7 posts
    January 30, 2016 12:54 PM EST

    personally, i see no reason for helping stormcloak if you not playing as nord, even when i play as nord and help stormcloak i still cant help but feel angry to see how they treat other race while saying nord is this and nord is that.. ironically nord are just the same like thalmor where they say they are superior among other race.. but that what i see when i play skyrim because mostly i play as khajiit

    • 27 posts
    March 8, 2016 2:10 PM EST

    Agree with this post. Though I do play Nords, I also play Imperials and Bretons as primary races. The occasional Bosmer too. I just see the whole Stormcloak rebellion as license to rampage as they will under Ulfric's leadership. I have tried to do the Stormcloak rebellion and all I see is Ulfric being a power hungry buffoon using racial tensions to justify his goals of dominion. It often colors my play throughs and I find most of my toons end up working for the Empire.