Elder Scrolls Lore » Discussions


Lore: The Eye of Magnus Lost and Found

Tags: #Skyrim  #Lore  #Saarthal  #Eye of Magnus 
  • Tom
    Member
    March 24

    Justiciar Thorien said:

    I never said they were stupid. At least no more than the humans who live on Earth right now. And those particular Nords would be especially unlikely to hate wizards, since they were ones themselves. But even in the modern world where people hsve books and internet such situation could happen, when people find something the knowledge about was lost long ago. They didn't have internet and didn't have even printed books. And it's a known fact that Nords prefer oral tradition to written chronicles. 

    Actually if they actually did leave the Eye alone, it means they are smarter then us the modern humans, we in our endless certainty that we know everything would never do so. Also people always fear the unknown, and that is totally a case thry encounter unknown, because it's highly unlikely that Ysgramor had studied the thing through and through and wrote a detailed manual. Seems more like he just said "that thing is evil and no one must touch it".

    No. You know exactly what you meant by this quote,

    "Sounds a bit too perfect to be true. Too, you know, logical))) And knowing that Nords were never big fans of books..."

    You're calling the Nords illogical and anti-intelectual, aka stupid. This sort of flippant reaction just sets me off in these discussions. Calling nords dumb is easy and factually indefensible. The Nords had books. Ysgramor invented runic writing.

    Yes, the nords valued their oral tradition since their oral tradition was literally magic. They had books. They valued history deeply. Knowledge is literally power for the ancient Nords. In Skyrim we get our knowledge of Saarthal from a fucking book written by Archamge Shalidor, the most power wizard and a Nord. The story of Saarthal is literally the founding myth of Ysgramor and the Atmorans returning to Tamriel.

    They knew about Saarthal in the time of Jyrik Gauldurson. Modern Nords have forgotten. But forgetting the past and a declining society aren't limited to the Nords in the 4th Era. Every province is in decline. The 4th Era is the beginning of another Dark Age in Tamriel.

  • March 24

    Nah, I merely meant that it's not how the nature of people is. Any people, not just Nords. Actually I'd say that if those were Altmer, they definitely wouldn't leave the Eye alone. They would be too sure that they won't make the same mistakes as others)))

    You are right, I forgot that the First Era Nords weren't the same as the Fourth Era ones. But even though they had books and knew the location of Saarthal, that doesn't mean they exactly knew what the Eye is, no one ever had. And it's normal for everyone to fear the unknown at least to some extent, so the situation that I described could still happen) Actually when I wrote it I had an image of some archeologists, who without a doubt would have a lot of books and internet, going into a "cursed" ancient tomb trembling all other. Those mages were obviously tougher guys but Saarthal is more than just some supposedly cursed tomb. 

    Hmm, another Dark Age in Tamriel? When was the frist one?

  • March 24

    As we know with Deadric Artifacts they come and go between the mortal plane and oblivion through the ages. So maybe the Eye of Magnus was at aetherius at the time frame the whole thing with Jyrik Gauldurson happened.

    Also there is a possibility that the events of Skyrim happen during a Dragon Break so time is messed up and we might be in for an adventure regarding lore and continuation of Tamriel's history with the next game.

    Another posibility is that the Nords even though they knew that the Eye of Magnus was a powerful artifact they didn't know how to use it properly so they just left it sealed there through the ages and it was slowly forgotten.

    Who knows..

  • March 25

    The Eye is very... special artifact, it's not like the other ones. And it never was in Aetherius. It actually has little connection to Magnus despite the name.

     

    Dragon Break is an easy explanation to anything, and that's why I refuse to go with it at least until it was established as canon.

    No one in Tamriel knows how to use it properly, neither Nords, nor anyone else. They knew a part of what it can do to a mortal, that was quite enough, so they sealed it and it was indeed forgotten. It is the most apparent.

  • July 1

    Ok, so we know that Gauldur, the father of Jyrik was the arch-mage of the College at some point in the first era. Is it possible that the ancient college knew of the location of the Eye of Magnus? It's just too big of a coincidence to me that the College sent us to the place: where a former arch-mage's son is sitting in front of an artifact of one of the Ancient Nord gods. The coincidence continues as another arch-mage Geirmund killed all three of the brothers and quote

    Be bound here, (Mikrul, Sigdis or Jyrik), murderer, betrayer

    Condemned by your crimes against realm and lord.

    May your name and your deeds be forgotten forever

    And the charm which you bear be sealed by our ward.

    -Writ of Sealing

    Firstly, this means that Geirmund atleast knew where Jyrik was sealed and was probably the one who tied Jyrik's life-force to the shield.What is the charm sealed by what ward? Is it possible that when the Psijic order shows up, and talks about putting something in motion that can't be undone. They are not solely talking about the Eye of Magnus but rather the Eye of Magnus which is guarded by an ancient foe, whose life source feeds the shield of the Eye of Magnus. I think this was intentional as Jyrik has too many ties to the Eye to ignore.

  • July 1

    It is indeed possible and likely that the 1st era College knew about Saarthal and the existance of the Eye, but the modern College only has records since the 2nd era and it's mentioned in several sources that until recently the location of Saarthal was unknown, so it seems that at some point between the 1st and the 2nd eras the data was lost. So it does seem to be a coincidence, unless you believe in fate))

    And, as far as I know, the Eye has no connection to any of the Nord gods.

    As for Gauldur's sons, according to the book, they murdered their father and took his amulet, which has no connection to the Eye at all, and then fled. I'm inclined to assume that the locations where they were sealed were the same locations to where they had fled rather than placed by Geirmund's men after their death. Also, when we fight Jyrik, it's quite obvious that it's not the Eye uses his life force but the other way around. What ties he has with the Eye beside that?

  • July 1

    Justiciar Thorien said:

    And, as far as I know, the Eye has no connection to any of the Nord gods.

    You're right I was misremembering information from the Nordic Pantheon page on Elder Scrolls Wiki

  • Member
    July 3

    Justiciar Thorien said:

    It is indeed possible and likely that the 1st era College knew about Saarthal and the existance of the Eye, but the modern College only has records since the 2nd era and it's mentioned in several sources that until recently the location of Saarthal was unknown, so it seems that at some point between the 1st and the 2nd eras the data was lost. So it does seem to be a coincidence, unless you believe in fate))

    As a matter of fact, I'm pretty sure all records of the whole Gauldur family incident were destroyed (it mentions it in "Forgotten Legends" I believe). This could even be why the college's records only go as far as the second era. It's not much but at the very least it's something that helps build a solid foundation for your argument, Thorien.

  • July 3

    You are right, all the records about it were indeed destroyed, and it's very likely that the data on the locations ehere Gauldur's sons were sesled away, including Saarthal, were purposefully destroyed as well. On the other hand there were other mages at that times and they must have let some records, so there likely had been some other incident later in the 2nd era when records fot destroyed, but still it is a possibility. It would be really interesting to learn more about the College's history, I think it would reveal a lot of new details about Nords and the evolution of their culture. But, too little data unfortunately.

  • Member
    July 4

    Justiciar Thorien said:

    You are right, all the records about it were indeed destroyed, and it's very likely that the data on the locations ehere Gauldur's sons were sesled away, including Saarthal, were purposefully destroyed as well. On the other hand there were other mages at that times and they must have let some records, so there likely had been some other incident later in the 2nd era when records fot destroyed, but still it is a possibility. It would be really interesting to learn more about the College's history, I think it would reveal a lot of new details about Nords and the evolution of their culture. But, too little data unfortunately.

    Don't get me wrong I doubt the Gauldur incident is why the records only go back to the second era, it is however still a possibility.

    As to the college, I'm a bit disappointed the place had to be so secretive; there is so much interesting cultural stuff we're missing out on. Not to mention the complete silence on the whole collapse thing...